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Featured Dispensation of Heresy documentary.

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Mikey, Dec 2, 2020.

  1. Mikey

    Mikey Active Member

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    Thoughts?

    Does it represent the doctrines of Dispensationalism correctly? What did they get wrong?
     
  2. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Do you actually want us to watch this whole 1 1/2 hour video? By a guy who starts out by calling Dispensationalism a "dangerous heresy"? That's what he get's wrong from the very start. I saw no need to watch past that. (Plus, the opening music was awful. :p) I'll say this further: by calling Dispensationalism a "dangerous heresy," he shows that he is clueless about the historical meaning of the term, used for things like Arianism, the Marcionites, the JW's, and so on.

    Here's the truth. Dispensationalism is based on a literal hermeneutic. Thus, it will never, ever lead to theological liberalism. It teaches us that (1) God is actively at work in history; (2) Jesus will come back to reign for 1000 years, fulfilling the Davidic Covenant; (3) the glory of God should be paramount in our theology, never our glory. And much more.
     
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  3. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    In my humbled opinion this is bull. If there are no dispensations then certainly the Bible has lied to us all.
    1Co_9:17 For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.
    Eph_1:10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:
    Eph_3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
    Col_1:25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;

    Paul was a dispensationalist whether you like it or not. Calvinism is heresy. It's not found in the Bible. Not taking scripture literally is what is wrong with Calvinism. These guys talk about taking God's word literally like it's sin. I take God's Word literally because I respect what God has to say. Those who don't are just philosophers.
    MB
     
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  4. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    How many different 'ways of salvation' are in Dispy? 7?, 12?
    How many Resurrections and 'Returns of Christ'? 3, 5, 7?
    Nothing constructive can be said for all it's imagined, but genuine heresies.

    So far, the first five minutes are beautiful.

    Thank you, for putting me in touch with these men.

    1.0.3b The Gospel of The Kingdom #1; 20th Century ‘Dispensationalism’ is practically identical to LOST 1st Century JEWS who CRUCIFIED JESUS
     
    #4 Alan Gross, Dec 2, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2020
  5. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    One.
    One resurrection, one return.

    These are the kind of ridiculous accusations people ignorant about the theology make.
     
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  6. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    When Jesus 'returns' to speak to the Jews, Personally, you don't have to, right?

    Which one of His 'returns' is that?

    It's all a Satanic fantasy.

    Satanic Fantacy is not a Bible Heurmenutic.



    1.0.3b The Gospel of The Kingdom #1; 20th Century ‘Dispensationalism’ is practically identical to LOST 1st Century JEWS who CRUCIFIED JESUS

    There is ONE Eternal Covenant of Grace that has been Administerered,
    by "God, who at sundry times and in divers manners
    spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
    2Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son,
    whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;"

    Hebrews 1:1,2

    Dispensation meaning:
    The Period of Stewardship and Administration of
    THE ACTS OF THE GRACE OF GOD
    TOWARDS AND UPON HIS ELECT this TIME
    (Patriarchal State, Mosaic, the Times of David and the Prophets, etc., etc.)


    These are those Administration Periods stated appropriately:

    John Gill, D.D. (1697-1771)
    English Particular Baptist Pastor and Theologian

    Click Here For A Brief Biography

    DOCTRINAL DIVINITY ~ BOOK IV

    OF THE ACTS OF THE GRACE OF GOD
    TOWARDS AND UPON HIS ELECT IN TIME


    Chapter 1: Of the Manifestation and Administration
    of the Covenant of Grace


    Chapter 2: Of the Covenant of Grace
    in the Patriarchal State


    Chapter 3: Of the Covenant of Grace
    under the Mosaic Dispensation
    *

    Chapter 4: Of the Covenant of Grace
    in the Times of David and the Prophets


    Chapter 5: Of the Abrogation of the Old Covenant

    Chapter 6: Of the Law of God

    Chapter 7: Of the Gospel

    Dispensation meaning:
    The Period of Stewardship and Administration of
    THE ACTS OF THE GRACE OF GOD
    TOWARDS AND UPON HIS ELECT this TIME
    (Mosaic, etc.)

    Unless a man is well-versed in these specific Doctrines
    they are susceptible to wild, rash errors
    involving assumptions regarding who 'Israel' is
    and might as well not bring their guns to town.

    Reference to abolish 'National Israel' from the Bible Students imagination, with regard to statements like, "Do you think they (LOST GOD-HATING, and REJECTING APOSTATE JEWS) have a sense that God has a special place for that country" Video @ 18:57

    Hope of Israel – Philip Mauro

    The main purpose of this chapter
    On the Literal Interpretation of Prophecy – Part 2 of ‘The Hope of Israel’
    is to demonstrate that the contrast in Scripture
    is not between the spiritual and the literal,
    but between the spiritual and the natural.

    A passage of Scripture, when taken ‘literally,’
    may refer either to ‘that which is natural’
    or to ‘that which is spiritual.’


    In other words, the literal interpretation
    may call for a thing which exists in the realm of nature,
    or for the counterpart of that thing
    which exists in the realm of spiritual realities


    (1 Cor. 15:46; Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual,
    but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
    )

    This is of critical importance,
    since the advocates of modern dispensationalism
    have wrought confusion,
    and have succeeded in giving plausibility
    to many misinterpretations of Scripture
    by first taking for granted that a ‘literal’ interpretation
    necessarily calls for something material or natural,
    and then insisting strenuously that all prophecies
    which refer to Israel, Jerusalem, Zion, etc.,
    should be interpreted in such a way.

     
    #6 Alan Gross, Dec 2, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2020
  7. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    I checked several places in the film, just to be fair. At one point they talk about kabbalah. What in the world does that have to do with the subject? I really didn't want to find out, so I skipped some more.

    Then at the end, we have the notorious pastor Steve Anderson preaching. If you want to be associated with Steve Anderson, go ahead, but I certainly won't.
     
  8. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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  9. OnlyaSinner

    OnlyaSinner Active Member
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    IMO, what people like me call dispensations are God's means of schooling us (Gal. 3:24-25) to show sinful humankind that they cannot meet the conditions, so that only by grace through faith can we be saved. The fact that Bible scholars don't agree on the number of dispensations is irrelevant to that truth.
     
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  10. Mikey

    Mikey Active Member

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    I've heard from dispensationalists that there was dispensation/s where one was saved by works.
     
  11. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Sounds good to me.
     
  12. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    I’m sure my understanding of dispensation theology is limited, so maybe you can help me.

    Do you believe there is a separate future for national Israel and the church?

    If so, how is that belief reconciled with Paul’s teaching in Eph. that Christ abolished the OT law and made Jews and Gentiles “one new man” in Christ by His death on the cross.

    If the “one new man” is separated into two groups once again doesn’t that require that the work of Jesus’s death in bringing the two groups together must be undone?

    I don’t see how it is possible to undo this joining.

    peace to you
     
  13. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    That would have to be a fringe type of dispensationalism. Scofield wrote something in one note of his reference Bible that has been construed to mean a works salvation in OT dispensations, but that possibility is denied by revised dispensationalism as taught by Charles Ryrie in his book, Dispensationalism. Ryrie wrote, "The positive teaching of dispensational writers is that salvation is always through God's grace" (p. 124). He then gives a great quote on that line from Chafer's Systematic Theology.
     
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  14. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    upload_2020-12-2_16-39-52.png
     
  15. Mikey

    Mikey Active Member

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    Is there a resource or you able to give a summary on the differences between Classical, Revised, Progressive Dispensationalism, and which group you fall into. Thanks
     
  16. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    I would not put it that way. I believe that there is a salvation future for Israel at the time of the 2nd Coming. At that time

    Dispensationalism does not deny that Christ fulfilled (not abolished; Matt. 5:17) the law. It does not deny that Jews and Gentiles are all one in Christ through His death on the cross. You are saying these things without giving any actual quotes from dispensationalists, so I am answering them simply.

    I don't see how it is possible to undo that either. I don't get what your point is in reference to dispensationalism. Do you have any quotes for me to interact with?
     
  17. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
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    Yes, Dispensationalism, by Charles Ryrie, discusses this fully, and also hyper-dispensationalism. As most dispensational theologians are nowadays, I fall in the revised dispensationalism group.

    A little book by Michael Vlach, Dispensationalism: Essential Beliefs and Common Myths, also does a good job of explaining the different types, and is a very reasonable price.
     
    #17 John of Japan, Dec 2, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2020
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  18. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    There are faults and problems in all theological views, as I hold to more Covenant theology view, but could make a movie on "heresy: of Infant baptism and how saying God "done" with Israel paved way for Holocaust!
     
  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Calvinism NOT heresy, but full free will Gospel is!
     
  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I have read though where some who teach Dispy have up to 7 resurrections, and that Jews under OC saved by law, and us now by grace!
     
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