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Featured Do the aborted and babies that die . . .

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by 37818, May 4, 2021.

?
  1. No.

    76.5%
  2. Maybe.

    5.9%
  3. Yes.

    11.8%
  4. No opinion.

    5.9%
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  1. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    That is a fact no matter how you look at it.
    Salvation is of the Lord..
    If God elected all....all will be saved.
    If He did not elect any ....none would be saved.
    All sinned and died in Adam.
    All who are saved are saved by mercy and grace.
     
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  2. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    Can't argue with that!... But I might add that none deserved!... Brother Glen:)
     
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  3. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    GOD KNOWS WHO HE IS SAVING AND FOR WHAT PURPOSE.
    HE CAN BE FULLY TRUSTED GEN18:25
     
  4. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    And I don't dispute that. But there is also nothing to suggest that infants that die are somehow elect. That's reading into Scripture.
     
  5. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Hello r1689,
    No need to read into it at all....
    The statement is carefully worded....it does not say...infants who die.

    It says....ELECT INFANTS DYING IN INFANCY.

    I saw your comment earlier.

    If elect infants exist.....the number of them and their location of them are known to God.They would be in scripture in Hebrews2:13-16.

    Do you know of any person who becomes saved that was not given by the Father to the Son?
     
  6. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    You are confusing civil law with God's manner of dealing with the wicked. It is a huge mistake on your part.
     
  7. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    It's no realistic if God visits the iniquity of the fathers unto the children of the 3rd and 4th generations of those who hate him.

    “The LORD is longsuffering, and of great mercy, forgiving iniquity and transgression, and by no means clearing the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation.Numbers 14:18 (KJV 1900)
     
  8. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    “The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.” Revelation 17:8 (KJV 1900)
     
  9. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    They are most likely Amyraldian 4 point "Calvinists" which is nothing more than Arminianism with a better smokescreen.
     
  10. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    You are confusing civil law with God's judgment of the wicked.
     
  11. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely solely of the Lord.
    Since all are not going to be saved, then all are not elected.
    That is also not the case, Ephesians 1:4.
    Not being guilty for Adam's sin. But having a sinful nature because of Adam's sin, Romans 5:12, Ezekiel 18:20.
    Absolutely. Ephesians 2:8, ". . . that not of yourselves . . . ."
     
  12. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Deuteronomy 24:16 is given as civil law to Israel.
    But Ezekiel 18:20 goes with Ezekiel 18:4 and Ezekiel 18:32. Has to do with how God is about sin.
     
  13. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    You do not understand the difference between God's cursing entire families and Israeli Civil Law. This is dangerous as it is two different situations and misrepresents God if you do not keep them separate.
     
  14. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    The decendants will be permitted to take up the same type of sins of their father's because of their father's hatred of God.
     
  15. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    What it says and what it is interperted to mean are two distinct issues. Names blotted out from the foundation of the world are not written from the foundation of the world. Neither are names never written, if that be the case. Now if the names were never written, then that would mean even a general redempion is a limited atonement. Names either blotted out or never written. Psalms 69:27-28, Revelation 3:5.

    Matthew 22:14, "For many are called, but few are chosen."
     
  16. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    It does not say this. It says he curses entire generations for the sins of the father.
     
  17. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    So what? It cannot mean contrary to what God says, Ezekiel 18:20, "The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him."
     
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  18. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    You are quoting civil law. Not the Ten Commandments and the threat God makes to the fathers who hate him. You grossly misrepresent God.
     
  19. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    Names were never written.............
     
  20. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    God hardens hearts so people will sin.
     
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