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Do The Unsaved Have a Conscience With God?

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Saved-By-Grace, Mar 5, 2018.

  1. Saved-By-Grace

    Saved-By-Grace Well-Known Member

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    "For when the Gentiles, who have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: Who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel. "
    (Romans 2:14-16)

    The Gentiles are those who are not Jews, and therefore the rest of the entire world that is non-Jewish. Taken together, the Gentiles and Jews make up the "whole human race". If you are not the one, then you most certainly were the other.

    Paul here says, that though the Gentiles, did not have the Law of Moses that was given to the Jews, yet they did have this same law of God "written in their hearts". This then gives them a "conscience" before God, and thereby leaves them with no excuse in their response to the Gospel Message, which will Judge them when they appear before the Judgement Seat of the Lord Jesus Christ. Same argument made in chapter 1.

    There are some who wrongly suppose, that the "unsaved" are so "dead", that they cannot "hear" the Gospel Message, and respond either way. This passage very clearly shows this to be wrong, as the Gentiles are here seen to be responsible for their actions, in either, accepting or rejecting "the law of God", in the Lord Jesus Christ.

    The Gentiles here cannot simply mean the non-Jewish Christians, as the term in Paul is for the lost heathen. Paul was The Apostle to the Gentiles, as Peter was the Apostle to the Jews.
     
  2. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    In Romans 3 Paul begins by asking what benefit the Jew has and he says "great in every respect" and then points out that the Jews have the "oracles of God" -- that is "The Word of God" -- scripture.

    So in Romans 2 when we see the gentile "with have no law" what Paul is really saying "Gentiles who have no access to scripture at all". He is not talking about those gentiles of Acts 13, and Acts 17 and Acts 18:4 who are hearing scripture "every Sabbath" Acts 18:4 in the synagogues.

    Yet as you point out in Romans 2 - even they are subject to the drawing and evangelizing power of God.
     
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  3. Saved-By-Grace

    Saved-By-Grace Well-Known Member

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    Notice how our Calvinistic friends are silent here, they are stumped by the Truth in the Word of God. Paul's words here basically destroy their unbiblical nonsense!
     
  4. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

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    I'm laughing out loud at this! You're quite the legend in your own mind, aren't you? Of course, your premise in this post is... wait for it... another logical fallacy.

    While I can't speak for others, many of us realize there are things that just can't be fixed, and we have better things to do than try.

    The Archangel
     
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  5. Saved-By-Grace

    Saved-By-Grace Well-Known Member

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    simply because you cannot face the Truth of Scripture, that shows up your "theology" as fallacy!
     
  6. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

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    Funny! Continue chasing your windmills if you must. Good night, poppet.

    The Archangel
     
  7. Saved-By-Grace

    Saved-By-Grace Well-Known Member

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    Like TCassidy, when you know you are stumped, you insult!
     
  8. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

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    Yawn...

    You should learn the difference between "Cannot" and "Will not." Your baiting me with your self-aggrandizing isn't going to work. You've demonstrated time and time again that you have certain incapacitates, and I'm choosing not to try to fix them. I have better things to do than cast my pearls in dirty places.

    The Archangel
     
  9. Saved-By-Grace

    Saved-By-Grace Well-Known Member

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    can you show from John chapter 5, that Jesus Christ's words are not directed to the Jews who wanted to murder Him, and tell them that He came to save them, and give them eternal life?
     
  10. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

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    And what does John 5 have to do with the OP about Romans 2????

    The Archangel
     
  11. Saved-By-Grace

    Saved-By-Grace Well-Known Member

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    well, show from either post where I am wrong, from the context?
     
  12. The Archangel

    The Archangel Well-Known Member

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    See, again, this post:

    The Archangel
     
  13. Saved-By-Grace

    Saved-By-Grace Well-Known Member

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    typical response from a Calvinist/Reformed, who cannot deal with Scripture facts, and simply dismiss what is said. The Bible tells us to PROVE ALL THINGS. In both my posts from Romans 2 and John 5, I have shown the system of Reformed theology on salvation to be Biblically wrong. Now show me that I am in error?
     
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