1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Doctrine of Unconditional Election 2

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Brightfame52, Nov 13, 2021.

Top Posters
Page 2 of 2
  1. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    535
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Scriptures that indicate that election to Salvation took place before the elect individual existed:

    Jeremiah 1:5 - “Before I formed thee in the belly, I knew thee, and before thou camest forth out of the womb, I sanctified thee.”



    Matthew 25:34 - “Then shall the King say unto them on His right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.”


    Ephesians 1:4 - “Even as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world.”


    2 Thessalonians 2:13 - “But we are bound to give thanks to God alway for you, brethren, beloved of the Lord, for that God chose you from the beginning unto salvation in sanctification of the Sprit and belief of the truth.”

    Compare also the phraseology used as to the names written in the Lamb’s book of life, Revelation 13:8 -

    “And all that dwell on the earth shall worship him (that is the beast), every one


    Revelation 17:8 - “And they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, they whose name hath not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast how that he was, and is not, and shall come.”
     
    #21 Brightfame52, Nov 17, 2021
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    535
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Again, you sound confused. This thread is about unconditional election.
     
    #22 Brightfame52, Nov 17, 2021
  3. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    535
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So what is election conditioned upon ?
     
    #23 Brightfame52, Nov 17, 2021
  4. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Messages:
    8,817
    Likes Received:
    2,106
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Election is not conditioned on anything. It is unconditional. But no one gets saved without repenting of his sins and trusting in Christ for salvation. These two truths are not in opposition but in the sweetest harmony.
     
    #24 Martin Marprelate, Nov 17, 2021
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  5. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2018
    Messages:
    7,953
    Likes Received:
    706
    Faith:
    Baptist
    How is what I say not directly related? Also, why the insults? If you had something to say, you wouldn't need to insult people.
     
    #25 1689Dave, Nov 17, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2021
  6. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2018
    Messages:
    7,953
    Likes Received:
    706
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Who did this when preaching the gospel? Are you preaching a different gospel in doing so?
     
    #26 1689Dave, Nov 17, 2021
  7. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    535
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Election guarantees the elect will repent and believe, but election isn't conditioned on those things.
     
    #27 Brightfame52, Nov 18, 2021
  8. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    535
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Dont mean to be insulting you. Put it like this then, Im confused on what you saying. How does it relate to unconditional election, thats my emphasis in this thread.
     
    #28 Brightfame52, Nov 18, 2021
  9. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    535
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Do you insinuate that to mention Christ died for His elect, His Sheep exclusively is a different Gospel like as in Gal 1:8-9 ?
     
    #29 Brightfame52, Nov 18, 2021
  10. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Messages:
    8,817
    Likes Received:
    2,106
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Let me try again. Election is unconditional, but those who are elect will repent and believe the Gospel at some point. If they don't, they are not elect.

    I think we're agreeing with each other.
     
    #30 Martin Marprelate, Nov 18, 2021
  11. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2018
    Messages:
    7,953
    Likes Received:
    706
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Where do you find anyone in the NT preaching the gospel your way?
     
    #31 1689Dave, Nov 18, 2021
  12. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2018
    Messages:
    7,953
    Likes Received:
    706
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Use Peter's sermon at Pentecost as an example of how to preach the gospel. It contains the gospel of the kingdom in its most developed state. Not a chirp about what you think it should be.
     
    #32 1689Dave, Nov 18, 2021
  13. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2010
    Messages:
    8,817
    Likes Received:
    2,106
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I wouldn't want to suggest that it's a different Gospel, but it is different from that preached in the book of Acts.
    The longest sermon by Peter that we find there is that preached at Pentecost. There he bids his hearers, 'Repent and be baptized, every one of you .....for the remission of sins.'
    The Longest sermon by Paul is the one he gave at Psidian Antioch, and in Acts of the Apostles 13:38-39, he says, 'Therefore let it be known to you, brethren, that through this Man is preached to you the forgiveness of sins; and by Him everyone who believes is justified from all things from which you could not be justified by the law of Moses.' there is no mention of election in either extract. Not that election isn't true, but it doesn't figure in these sermons.
    Incidentally, that last verse destroys the idea of Justification from eternity.
     
    #33 Martin Marprelate, Nov 18, 2021
  14. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Messages:
    16,071
    Likes Received:
    1,243
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The word here translated "chose" is at no place* translated "elect." [* In the KJV as a reference.] εκλεγομαι
     
    #34 37818, Nov 18, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2021
  15. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    535
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Actually Peter preached Limited atonement in Acts 2, He was speaking specifically to the House of Israel Gods Elect Acts 2:36

    36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
     
    #35 Brightfame52, Nov 18, 2021
  16. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2020
    Messages:
    3,052
    Likes Received:
    535
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Still the same. Jesus used them to refer to the same people Mk 13:20


    And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
     
    #36 Brightfame52, Nov 18, 2021
    • Winner Winner x 1
  17. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Messages:
    16,071
    Likes Received:
    1,243
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Good call.
     
    #37 37818, Nov 18, 2021
  18. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Messages:
    16,071
    Likes Received:
    1,243
    Faith:
    Baptist
    That the elect do not merit their election according to God's will. [Matthew 7:21 God's will]
     
    #38 37818, Nov 18, 2021
(You must log in or sign up to post here.)
Page 2 of 2
Loading...