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Does Christianity require Pacifism

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Earth Wind and Fire, Jul 9, 2019.

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  1. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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  2. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
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    Does Christianity require pacifism?

    I hope not. I ain't sucked one of them since I was a baby.
     
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  3. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    That answer right there could open up all sorts of commentary;)
     
  4. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    But it does track the trajectory from the Old Testament to the new, reflects on malice as a motivation and describes just cause ( for protection of self and love ones). I believe the article was well done.
     
  5. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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  6. old regular

    old regular Member

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    I believe based on the teachings of our Lord it definitely does at times, I do believe there are justifiable actions , like the goodman of the house not suffering his goods to spoiled. The general tenor of Christ teaching us to '"Love our enemies pray for them that despitefully use us etc. "
     
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  7. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Unto death? To martyrdom? That is not your stance. Our God is The God of Life, not allowing that His Children should be abused.
     
  8. old regular

    old regular Member

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    Like I said there are justifiable actions however turning the other cheek is a form of being a pacifist , we should live peacefully with all men as much as lies within you. I wouldn't be an extreme pacifist anymore than I would be an extremist on most issues . Christ speakes concerning his kingdom not being of this world and his servants not fighting. Myself I did serve in the Armed Forces in a non combant position a Hospital Corpsman . Elder Gilbert Beebe didn't believe in Primitive Baptist being engaged in War Combat. So what I am saying there are various degrees of pacifism the New Testament teaches alot about it, but even in the New Testament there is some reference about protecting your own house and goods.
     
  9. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    I was Primitive Baptist for 35 years... I was raised in the church and fought in Vietnam with the Marines 1965-1966 and was in the tank division... Though I hadn't joined the church when I fought, I had still be going to church since the age of seven... I joined the church after I got back in 1968 and soon got out in 1969... I know a lot of brethren in the Primitive Baptist Church that served in the military, now weather they were in the church at the time when they served, that I didn't know... I did know my Dad didn't because WWII was over after him and my mother joined... I would like to hear the comments from one who is a Christian and is in now, and I believe I found one... Now if can only persuade him to come over here?... Brother Glen:)
     
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  10. delizzle

    delizzle Active Member

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    Despite what Christian pacifists would have us believe, God is not a pacifist. The Bible is filled with examples of God taking bloody vengeance on His enemies (Isaiah 63:3–6; 65:12; Deuteronomy 20:16–18). And those examples are not limited to the Old Testament. It is impossible to read the book of Revelation without seeing the Lamb of God in His role as the Lion of Judah (Revelation 5:5; 19:11–15). The imagery is clear that Jesus will overcome His enemies with war (Revelation 19:19–21). This is the same Jesus who is quoted by pacifists to support their cause.

    In short, personal pacifism should be the goal, to a large degree, of every follower of Christ. We are called to live in peace, as much as we are able to do so (Romans 1:18; Hebrews 12:14). We should be willing to turn the other cheek (Matthew 5:39), lend freely (Luke 6:30), and even be cheated if it means not dishonoring the name of Christ (1 Corinthians 6:7). When peace is an option, we should pursue it as far as it will go. But when the lives and liberties of others are threatened, a higher law draws us to their defense (Proverbs 24:11–12; John 15:3). When a nation needs to defend itself from those who would destroy its peace, true peacemakers join forces to protect it.
     
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  11. delizzle

    delizzle Active Member

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    In other words, a true Pacifist is one who loves peace so much that he is willing to fight and die to protect it.
     
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  12. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    The Holy Spirit does that brother. I myself still am struggling with this pacifism stance since as Old Regular says we are also as Christians called to protect house and goods (I interpreted that to mean kith and kin).
     
  13. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    This is my understanding as well... thanks.
     
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  14. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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  15. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    Matthew 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.

    Does peace maintain itself or is it our christian obligation to maintain the peace?... This country was not found on Pacifism we would still be under the religious oppression we escaped from if we took that stance... We must not be like the ones the Lord told Gideon not to choose, who lapped water like a dog... We should be like the 600 who he did. who took a drink of water, with one hand cupped, sword in hand, with diligence looking right and left for the enemy... Thank you for the reference Van with the OP's that 1689Dave has been posting on here, he's telling us that we are the bad guy... Brother Glen:)
     
    #15 tyndale1946, Jul 14, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2019
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  16. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    I think Jesus gave us the balanced view leading up to his incarceration. He told his disciples to buy swords if they didn't have one. Then, when the disciples said they had two, he told them that was enough.

    When he was arrested, he questioned his arrestors, saying he was not leading a rebellion and they did not need to arrest him bearing weapons.

    Christians are allowed to bear defensive weapons, such as guns, for personal selfdefense and defense of their friends and families, but they are not to gather as armies to take over lands. The Church is not a nation like Israel. The Church is to go into other nations and submit to their authority and live a good testimony (Rom. 13). They are not to go in and seize lands by force.
     
  17. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    Turning the other cheek to a SMACK is one thing, but NO cheek should willingly take a blow from a ball bat. Also, after turning the other ckeek & getting it smacked, one is outta cheex. Time to smack back !

    Remember, one who beats his guns into plowshares will plow fields for he who doesn't !
     
  18. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    Yeah, there's a difference between insult and assault. A smite on the cheek is akin to an insult. We can take that. It's not going to do any serious harm. He's not commanding us to withstand assaults. For those Jesus said, sell your coat and buy a sword.

    Seems Jesus was saying, don't sweat the small stuff. If they want your scarf or coat, it's really not that big of a deal. If they ask for your car or house, that's a different story. If they ask you to walk a mile, what's the big deal? They're not asking you to move to another country and leave your family.
     
  19. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    Pacifism is not a biblical position. But non violence means you are willing to die rather than disobey Jesus' words about loving enemies instead of using physical violence against them.
     
  20. GaoLu

    GaoLu Member

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    Jesus taught turning the other cheek and non-violence. He did not teach pacifism. I am staunch on non-resistance in the Sermon-on-the mount sense, however, I am not a pacifist.

    If God clearly calls me to stand up, to commit an act of violence and leads the way, I shall be first in line to fall behind Him and obey. Such events occurred with Israel at times, but Israel was not to go out until God clearly spoke and lead Israel Himself. If or when God clearly calls me to battle and leads the way Himself, then I shall stand in front, wave my banner and march first. Until then, I shall follow Jesus' teachings as they are written and sow peace.

    Guidelines for choosing pacifism or resistance would include,
    1. What does Jesus teach?
    2. What do trusted Godly counselors advise (this might not include military personnel who might offer counsel or orders of the ungodly)?
    3. How does the Holy Spirit Guide me/us?

    If Jesus and Godly advisors and the Holy Spirit clearly say, "Shoot that man" I would, although I am skeptical such a thing has or ever will happen (of course, delusions exist--I exclude those). Until then, I shall suffer and love him and offer Him bread and water and the Gospel.
     
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