Featured Does God have totally free will?

I think if that is the case then Christ was NOT "...in all ways tempted as we are,yet without sin"

True!::thumbsup:

Less true

 

I remember that one! And I know the context of which He said it. Do you, or have you been drinking that deterministic Crystal Light?

 

:love2::thumbs::thumbs::love2: Many of the things we argue here may be better understood that way. This may be of interest along those lines when trying to grasp just what time may be or how it relates to God. http://www.leaderu.com/offices/billcraig/docs/divine.html

 

2+2= 4 simply because the system of logic that we have developed called arithmetic and more broadly mathematics defines it as such.

 

Well, first of all, I hope no one here is expecting me to explain God. I am simply trying to show my view as I have arrived to it from scripture.

The physical world is ruled by laws, and God created those laws. The laws can be known as truths, thus 2 + 2 = 4 in our physical world that God has created, this cannot be broken (at least by us). Now, the fact that God can perform miracles shows he is above those physical laws. It is physically impossible for a man to walk on water, but both Jesus and Peter walked on water. So God can overrule physical laws.

But I believe God has his own laws as well. Truth is truth. I do not believe God can tell a lie, and that lie would be true simply because he is God. This is confirmed by Jesus himself, he said that if he denied he knew his Father, then he would be a liar.

Jhn 8:55 Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.

Jesus is God, and Jesus said if he denied he knew his Father he would be a liar. So, Jesus, and God by extension cannot just say ANYTHING and that makes it correct and truth. It must be truth indeed.

Do you understand what I am saying?

 

Yes, I understand. It was a very good post and clear. Are you feeling ok?

 

Actually, I stayed home from work today because my back is hurting me. When I was around 16 years old I was riding on the back of a motorcycle with an older friend. He was showing off, going very fast, and I was begging him to slow down. He laughed and went even faster.

There was a sharp S turn coming up, and I was fearful a car would be coming around. My worst fears did come true, as we rounded the curve we were right in front of a car. It was either hit the car head-on or swerve off the road. My friend swerved and we ran into a fence that ran alongside this road. It threw both of us about 100 feet. My back was injured and sometimes it comes back on me, today was one of those days.

 

Good question!

Would say that God already knew ALL possible decisions/events that could have happen, and that he always chooses what is best one, based upon what is most consistant with His nature and Attributes, and what is best for his creations!

 

actually, God IS

truth and lying is contrary to truth.

How do we know blue is the color chose? Even the sky is under the curse, maybe blue is a result of the curse.

It is absolute truth. God only determines that which is absolute truth.

Not understanding how you arrived at that conclusion, could you expand more on that thought?

 

If God manifested in the flesh(Jesus) had the ability to lie, and chose not to, then Moses could have done the same job of dying for us. God can not lie. Jesus is God. Therefore, Jesus could not lie while here on earth. Jesus was/is the perfect, pristine, impeccable, spotless, w/o blemish, Lamb of God.

 

I'm sure this has been touched upon. One, the Scriptures state that it is impossible for God to lie, and that He cannot deny Himself.

We're told a good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, and vice versa.

"Free will," as we define it, does not exist. In order for God to lie, He would first have to be corrupted, and that is impossible, because He is also uncorruptible.

Two: the options for a good material universe are unlimited. We have what God chose to create for Himself and His purposes.

The difference? One is the nature of Heaven, and the other is the nature of earth.

 

Corruptibility is not a prerequisite for temptation. Adam was corruptible, Christ is not.

 

We are the branches. God the Father is the gardener. Jesus is the true vine and only in Him can we produce good fruit. So who is the good tree the Holy Spirit? Only God is good.

 

Aaron,

I have a question...not trying to start anything, just really want to understand this perspective.

Do you believe man has anything to do with the determination/development of his nature? For example, the old 'garbage in - garbage out' principle which teaches that if we choose to surround ourselves with negative influences we will be negatively influenced. Our character appears to develop over the course of a lifetime and seems to be directly affected by the choices we make. You seem to suggest that one is born with a fully developed nature (character) and is thus determined by that inborn nature to choose whatever it has be predisposed to choose. (i.e. animal instinct)

 

God is good. Whatever God does is good by definition. We learn what is good because of God. God answers to nothing outside of himself. How do we know that lying is bad and truth is good? Because God is truth and does not lie.

 

:thumbsup: Well stated!

 

I will simply disagree for now- something tells me, however, that the position you take (and those who see as you do) is as much motivated by an unconscious belief that yours is the more pious view to take, and the temptation not to take the LESS pious view is irresistible. Maybe that has something to do with it?

Given your premises I do not necessarily see why he could not. Were he indeed sinless, were God to lay the sins of the world upon his shoulders....dunno what constrains the possibility if God chose to do it that way?

Yes He was, so what? Are these simply pious airs? Especially with this one....

Really????? Not FALSE...... but I have never heard the Almighty described this way. This is an adjective usually reserved for Beaches or impeccably maintained classic cars.

 

I think 12 strings you would have to even more succinctly define "totally free" That is a phrase not used often.