Does the New Testament teach us that we can use instrumental music in worship

I was just reminded of this in another thread, on the subject of instruments in Church, let's use the heavenly Choir as our example...

[8] And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.
[9] And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

 

Ok one more Acts 7:41 And they made a calf in those days, and offered sacrifice unto the idol, and rejoiced in the works of their own hands.
I believe like Cain the tiller of the ground, and any thing man does to worship God with his hands is no good. As Isaiah Fortold in 17:7-8 At that day (our time) shall a man look to his Maker, and his eyes shall have respect to the Holy One of Israel. And he shall not look to the altars, the work of his hands, neither shall respect that which his fingers have made, either the groves, or the images.

Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. :8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. :9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you.

So this is what I am saying we can not worship God in the Flesh only in the Spirit that is in us. Romans 2:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: This is the one in I John 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethern. Its the inward man that passed from death unto life so its after the inward man we worship God. The outward man has not passed from death unto life yet. He still going to the grave 2 Corinthians 4:16 For which cause we faint not; but through our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day. So I believe we deny ourselves (outward man) and through the Spirit worship God in Truth, (Inward man) So this is why I do not use dead Instruments in worship. But sing making melody in my heart. Not to convince you any more of my position but ask if you can see my conviction in what I am saying maybe respect my belief a little more any how. I know many Don't get me on this view but it an old view in the Church. History can teach you that. ...............In peace bro. Jeremy

 

This isn't the issue of the thread.

The CoC isn't being criticized for using musical instruments and implying that they are ungodly for not using them. It's the other way around. Those churches that do use musical instruments are being criticized as only caring what man thinks, not what God thinks.

If using musical instruments should be thought of as a conviction, then this debate is over because conviction does not equal command.

How is the voice any less physical, fleshly, or carnal than the hands? They are both physical body parts, but you're saying that the voice is somehow less carnal than the hands.

Is there any other way to worship God besides singing, or is that it? I will never understand this idea you guys seem to have that singing is the only way to worship God.

 

Psalm 47:1--Clap your hands, all you nations;
shout to God with cries of joy.

2 Timothy 1:6--For this reason I remind you to fan into flame the gift of God, which is in you through the laying on of my hands.

Ephesians 4:28--He who has been stealing must steal no longer, but must work, doing something useful with his own hands, that he may have something to share with those in need.

Romans 12:1--Therefore, I urge you, brothers, in view of God's mercy, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God—this is your spiritual act of worship

Jeremy,

You did not negate Romans 12:1 with your statement. It is possible to worship with your hands. Ask any deaf person! Also listed are other scriptures that indicate God is pleased with the works of our hands that are fully dedicated to Him...and that is an act of worship.

You mention "dead" instruments...I understand why you put that spin on it...it gives credence to your position. But, today, in worship, I'll be playing keyboards in one of our services. They are made of metal, plastic, microchips, circuits, and the like. Is that what you mean by "dead?" We use inantimate objects to assist us with worship all the time:

-The Bible (insofar as the binding, paper, and physical components of it).
-Offering plates

Of course, you mean "dead" because you're trying to insinuate that God cannot bless it...am I right?

Still no scriptural proof from you guys--only scriptural silence--and we're on page 15?

 

I would have to say you hit the nail on the head with your comment. The phrase I hightlighted at the top is YOUR answer I BELIEVE this is why there are so many denominations today. We can take the same book and read it and if you have 10 people in a room all 10 will come to a different conclusion on something in the book. Then we take what we believe it says and start preaching it as gospel and no one is right except what we believe. The bible in my opioun is a love story and was written as such it was never intended to be disected.

 

Ok I believe we worship through the spirit and this may cause us to clap our hands and rejoice. But its all in the Spirit. Its not of my hands that please God but of the Spirit, this may cause tears of joy, Praises to his name or to raise holy hands. But if music is ok and so is every other carnal things we do in nature. Play basketball for Jesus or Ride our Motorcycles or Bench Press for the Lord. These things is what I am ruling out. These are the works of our hands that are not fruit of the Spirit. I am not saying all these things are bad in their selves but I do not believe we can worship God with them the same with Music. I am not trying to change the thread just show my position in a passive way. You all win the debate but I still hold my position. I responded because I want to encourage "God's Word is Truth" I believe his name is Dustin. The world loves Music I can't change the World but maybe some that come out of the world.
..........If the Lord moves we should move but if the Lord doesn't move then we should hold firm............

 

and let me add something if I may...

...I don't wish to discourage Dustin or anyone else. If you believe that acappella is the way to go, then go for it! No worries here...I just didn't want it prescribed for all Christians.

 

The answer to all of these is no. However, the reason for answering no to these is different than the reason you argue for not having musical instruments.

1. We do not add cake and ice cream to the Lords' Supper because the bread specifically shows the broken body and the wine specifically shows the shed blood. These are symbols of the real thing. Cake and ice cream have nothing to do with this and is a poor comparison.

2. We can not baptize by pooring or sprinkling because emersion symbolizes the burial and one is not partially buried. This falls short once again of your argument that instruments are wrong because they are not mentioned. The reason for not doing this is not the same as the reason you have been arguing.

3. We do not baptize infants because they have not made a choice and are not themselves confessing their identity with Christ. Again the reason for this is not the same reason you argue against musical instruments.

4. We do not offer incense to God because it is no longer necessary as the curtian is gone and we now have direct access to our Lord. The reason for this does not match your argument for no instruments.

5.We do not offer sacrifices because the very thing they shadowed has come to pass making them no longer necessary. This fails to resemble your argument for no instruments.

Good luck with your position though.

 

Here is one New Testament example of stringed instruments being used in the church. I know some people do not believe in using the original Greek and Hebrew languages, but it is quite obvious that they make things a little more clear than what the KJV says. Colossians 3:16 says " Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord." Psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs are three different entities. Psalms were religious songs that were sung using string instruments both in the Old Testament and in the New Testament. Paul tells the Colossians to sing of the grace in their hearts to the Lord. Therefore, there is nothing unscriptural about using stringed instruments in the church.

 

Yes, some of Revelations is written in code so that John could get it delivered from the isle of Patmos. If the vials were intended to be a code, it would have been a very poor code because the explination is in the exact same sentence. Do you see another explination of the harps in the sentence? Then I conclude he must have meant harps.

Marriage is not in heaven because there is no flesh in heaven. There is also no male or female. There is, on the other hand, worship in heaven. So I believe we can use worship in heaven as a templete to how it should be done on earth.

 

No, no no.

Revelation 21:1 -- Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away.

Heaven is also a physical place. We will have new bodies.

 

If we were living at that time and understood the true language John wrote revelations and were knowledgable in scripture then no, the word beast would not have been code. It is code to us today but was understood by the early Church. But since neither of us lived then, I guess it is code to us. I can speculate but the word beast is not defined.

[10] I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,

I'll let you decide, did John physically go to heaven?

 

Please refer to the sermon outline in Post #275 . . . . .

Are we being told that if we use instruments, and because we are not following a direct command from God, that we as Cain, will not have God's respect. Or like Nadab and Abihu, we could suffer the ultimate punishment of death?