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Featured Don’t Be A Fundamentalist (Calvinist Or Otherwise)

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Revmitchell, Feb 14, 2018.

  1. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    oh, really?

    And you have both pointed out and proved the narrative to be false?

    Did the narrative use the words "irresistible grace?"
     
  2. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Agedman, All you seem to want to do is find fault with all that I say. Fine
    If you want to address the issue, have at it. :)
     
  3. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Wasn't finding fault, only remarking that one should establish a focused disagreement before others need to comment.

    This you did in post # 29.

    But, what you do not seem to accept is that others who disagree with you have as much claim to the truth as do you.

    For example:
    You state,
    "John 1:13 says we are born by the will of God. But it does not say why God chooses to save the individuals in view. That is taught in the verse above, those that received Him, that believed in His name."​

    Now you are correct in pointing out John 1:12 establishes a line of demarkation between those that literally turn from the light and those who do not.

    However, those that do not turn from the light and believe in His name is not from personal effort done of their own strength which John is most certainly pointing out.

    For the light must first be presented by God, the light must be focused upon the people; that from the all, there are those who do turn away and those who do not turn away and are given the authority to be adopted.

    The differential is established in comparing those that turn from the light as opposed to those who do not. Those that turn from the light are not given authority as compared to those who do not turn from the light are given such authority. There is no effort in not turning from the light. Nor is there effort in receiving the light, for the light is already present. There is no effort in belief, but a statement of fact.


    Do you not also agree?
     
    #63 agedman, Feb 22, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
  4. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    The "false narrative" is that in some way the unmerited favor of God (Grace) can be resisted.

    God's grace is not determined upon humans nor upon human reaction.

    This is shown in the area of the grace of God in the gift of the Son. "While we were yet (even still) sinners..."

    God's grace is poured out upon all humankind and cannot be resisted, for resistance would be an indication of some authority in the distribution of God's grace, but such authority is never given to humankind.

    God chooses to pour out unmerited favor according to His own desires, and not that of human kind. How much grace, the quality of the grace and to what purpose (accomplishment) the grace of God is given is completely determined and established by God.

    Typical of the unregenerate human thinking is that God can be manipulated so that His grace is accessible or thwarted at will by the human. Such is the religion of the heathens who must appease a god and present gifts that the false god would be favorable to them.

    Our God is not of that character. The God presented in the Scriptures is one who is both just (one who rightly condemns) and the justifier (one who rightly rectifies). For while we did and continue to do great evil and iniquity, God's grace abounds.

    Our God is not turned away by the human condition, but pours out His favor upon the just and the unjust. Such is that general unmerited favor toward all creation.

    Although all humanity turns from His unmerited favor and yet strives to attain favor based upon their terms and thinking, God is not unaware, and continues to this day to grant that unmerited favor.

    Why then is it beyond some thinking to expect any less from God when it comes to His unmerited favor to those He chooses to be His own adopted sons?

    It is inconsistent in logic to have a God who most certainly pours out general unmerited favor upon all humanity who have no authority in the amount or purpose, in some manner, then be restricted by humans when it comes to such favor for those He chooses to redeem.

    Such thinking just isn't logical and provides a false narrative.
     
    #64 agedman, Feb 22, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
  5. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Does anyone know what the author meant? Come to God meant putting our trust in Jesus for salvation, Jesus works in him meant who knows what. Agedman thinks it was irresistible grace apparently but did not make a declarative statement. And note the continued use of euphemisms
    Is he saying light focused is irresistible grace. Maybe. Who knows.

    If anyone is willing to speak plainly, let him post!.
     
  6. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Can you find if this is supported in Scripture?

    “Come to God...” is found in Hebrews and 1 John.

    Is it related to “trusting for salvation?”

    Or, is the use that of a believer?
     
  7. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Goodbye again, you are not trying to address the issue.
     
  8. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    So, pointing out the Scripture statements concerning "come to God" is not addressing the issue you raised?

    ok
     
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