Entertainment as bait?

If you have to ask what is wrong with "christian [removed inappropriate reference]", you have deeper issues than worrying about having fun at church. [Removed personal attack/name calling].
Nobody ever said the church CAN'T spread the Gospel...but that is NOT the primary responsibility of the local church. You really need to learn to read!

 

Thanks. He's 20 months already. In February he will be a "big" brother.

 

That is uncalled for.

 

How dare you compare giving pizza to kids to such filth.

Shame on you.

 

I apologize if I offended you or anyone for that matter. Truth is there is an industry out there ... [removed inappropriate reference], giving them the gospel. It is the most extreme thing I have ever heard of, but how do you think it began? If you are going to sell a product you have to have a market, if your product is selling good you have to have a pretty decent sized market. Right?

Any how, my point is this. Fun, is fun, is fun, is fun. There is a place for fun. Not in worship services. Do I have a blast getting ready for church, I don't know if I would call it that. But I would say that I look forward to it all week and also have a less fulfilling week if I miss services on a Sunday. I love going to God's House with my family, I look forward to that more than anything else. I also enjoy having Bible Studies with my son. I get just as much out of it as he does. Young minds absorb so much.

There is a place for fun, but how much fun, who monitors it, and when it begins to replace doctrine and the message of Christ is lost in the fun, that is when it is going too far. But who stops it?

Look at music for example, Christian Rock, what's wrong with that, we will have it at church to bring in the youngsters, it has a good message. Not really, Christian Rock is an oxymoron, but there is a market for it, same as Christian Pornography. The bad thing is this, people use fun to bring people in and have to constantly use fun to keep them coming back.

I prefer to see the Gospel used to bring people in, win souls, and disciple the flock. We can have pizza in the fellowship hall on the last night of the revival.

Thanks, again, sorry if I got a little too carried away, but that is the way I see things. What do you give in on and what is too much. There are [removed inappropriate reference] today that go and speak at churches, travel the country telling congregations how they are reaching people with the Gospel through message filled movies. But I guess that is another topic for another day.

[removed reply to a previously edited post].

 

Man I should have saw that coming a mile away. I knew it would cause some outrage, but that is what I think when churches start changing formats and bringing in new ideas and new improved ways of worshipping. I don't think [removed inappropriate reference], but I do think, "How far is this going to Go".

Sorry if I hit a nerve. That was uncalled for and should not have been brought up. Is that is the user guidelines?

He started it, he said he didn't want to come to my church first!!

 

I just saw this thread, and you have hit a nerve and gotten my dander up!

VBS is the number 1 outreach there is. And just because you don't check off X numbers of responses to an alter call or baptisms doesn't mean God hasn't used it to speak to the hearts of kids.

Everything we do is connected to the message from God's Word - games, snacks, crafts, songs, as well as the Bible time. Many, many seeds planted in fertile ground. Even if they only came for the fun.

 

Thanks for making that clear. I'll make sure I don't have any fun at the next worship service I attend.

 

This same Jesus also ate with tax collectors and sinners. Should we not do the same? We're not just eating pizza...we're building relationships.

I have enough respect as your brother in Christ to respect your difference of opinion here. I ask for the same respect.

I just met with a young man a few minutes ago. I thought that I was going to help lead him to Christ. But his baseball teammates took care of that business with him last night!!! His first exposure to our church? A burger with a few of our guys after church. He was intrigued by their authenticity and their unashamed stand for Christ. He came to a couple of "fun" events...but now he "gets it."

When I asked him about being baptized, he said, "What's the soonest we can do this thing?"

Now...tell me that our time building relationships wasn't valuable. This guy's eternal destiny is worth buying a pizza or two for...you think?

Anyone that knows my heart knows that pizza ain't the point. But if my God wants to use pizza to get to the point, then great.

 

To me, as a senior pastor, as much as I want to see the local church grow numerically, I will not veer off into the entertainment culture.

Whenevera local church gives into the entertainment culture to attract members, that church is missing the point. I am reminded of what Paul says, "I planted, Apollos watered, but God was causing the growth" (1 Cor 3:6).

God is the one building his church. When I think I must entertain to build the church, I am taking the place of God. Isn't that what the Emergent church has morphed into? What a monstrosity!

 

God keeps moving mightily at our church. I don't understand it. We're occasionally having fun and laughing (and occasionally crying and being sorrowful). We're passionate about our God here.

But obviously, God is mistaken. I'll forward Him the rules that prohibit Him from darkening the doors of our church. My apologies...I wasn't aware He wasn't welcome.

What were those rules again? So far I have...

• No fun ever in worship. Don't laugh or enjoy anything. Never celebrate. It doesn't mean what you think it means...it means not to celebrate. Yeah.
• Don't eat pizza...that leads to [removed reference to already edited material].
• Don't use unapproved music. See 2 Hezekiah or 1 Confusions for more.
• Remember...Jesus was a good guy and all, but we are to pattern our lives after Jonathan Edwards, not Jesus.
• When in doubt, cast aside the "priesthood of the believer" for blanket condemnations of anyone who does things differently...instead of lifting them up in prayer and asking God to guide them.

Is that about it?

 

2. Pizza doesn't lead to [removed inappropriate reference], Fun does!!!!

 

Good words.

And praise God that in His wisdom, He sends what needs sending to the particular person.

Folks need to hear about sin, judgement, and repentance.
Folks also need to be loved.

Some people speak the truth, but forget the "in love" part.
Others are so focused on being "loving" they forget the truth.

How 'bout both?

 

J Jump?????

Ummmmmmmmm!!!!!

Would they by chance be looking for a pastor:godisgood: -----or would being pastor reduce my chances of winning that Harley???

Non-the-less----Blackbird is thinkin' about movin' his letter this next Sunday---win the Harley---and then movin' his letter back!!!

Or would that be seen as slightly less that being a cheap-skate???

:laugh: :laugh:

 

Fine, then. I spent 30 minutes trying to talk this guy out of this decision--explaining what it meant to confess Jesus as Lord and repent. I candy-coated nothing. He's ready to roll. Sorry you doubt.

It disappoints me to see a brother in Christ be so cynical. What if Paul, after his conversion, would have had no one to stand with him as the cynics spoke against him. Thank God for Barnabas and his encouragement. This young man will be discipled, encouraged, and held accountable. And you know what? Even though his two friends, two senior guys, didn't attend a Ray Comfort Evangelism School...God used their passion, their love for their friend, and SCRIPTURE (yes, they even used SCRIPTURE) to draw this guy to Christ. Doubt all you want.