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Europe debates about God

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by Helen, Feb 6, 2003.

  1. Helen

    Helen <img src =/Helen2.gif>

    Aug 29, 2001
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    In trying to come to wording, inclusions and exclusions in a new European Union constitution, there is a growing debate over whether any reference to God should be included. From an article about it:

    "I think there's an embarrassment to admitting to religious belief in our modern culture," said John Bruton, a former Irish prime minister and a member of the presidium.

    Mr. Bruton said he supported the text that speaks of God as a "source of truth" because it would apply, he said, to the three major monotheistic religions in Europe.

    the NYT article is here:

    (note: these articles do not stay accessible forever to non-paying viewers. If you want it, copy the page onto a Word doc)

    As I read the article this morning, the sarcastic side of me wondered if they had any clue at all that there would be a time when God would judge THEM, as to whether any one of them should be included or excluded...

    The historic side of me felt deeply saddened, knowing that all of European progress in the past had been a result of dependence upon God -- and His honoring of that. It is, in fact, only in those countries that broke away from the Catholic church (for whatever reason!) that we see the greatest advances in science and social welfare and economy -- note England and Germany -- in the last 500 years. (This is well documented in Pearcey and Thaxton's "Soul of Science" as well as many other places)

    This official marginalizing of God can only be seen as a threat to believing Christians (read Baptists, there, for from what I understand that is the designation used in many places, especially Eastern Europe, for what we consider born again believers) in their ability to pass on the faith to their children and share it with others.

    Already in one Australian state (Victoria) as well as in at least one European country (I forget which), if any discussion you have with anyone -- even in your own home -- is offensive to anyone else, the person claiming to be offended can have you brought to court where you are guilty until proven innocent and risk either a jail sentence or fine or both.

    Hard times are coming on fast now...
  2. rufus

    rufus New Member

    Jan 20, 2003
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    Helen, thanks for the info.

    Rufus [​IMG]
  3. InHim2002

    InHim2002 New Member

    May 26, 2002
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    couple of other things:

    so France doesn't count then? it is the world's fifth largest economy you know!

    that is a strange comment - a number of european societies have no seperation between church and state ( ie UK) and a number have little effective seperation (Spain, Italy etc).

    In Europe you don't see people arguing over the display of religious symbols anywhere near as much as you do in the US - I think this is because European societies are largely secular.

    Anyhow this is first I had heard of this so thanks for the info