Falling away

Because I think that premillennialism is a false teaching and that Jesus is not going to do any such thing. My eschatological belief is amillennial in nature and I believe that is what best fits The Holy Scriptures.

 

Well that explains why you are so quick to back candidates that want to withdraw all support from Israel, and don't agree that Christians should support candidates that will try to outlaw abortion.

It is remarkable that a Christian wouldn't do anything, given the power, to legally stop a woman in labor from going to a Dr. and saying "I've changed my mind. I don't want this baby," and the Dr.'s, even in a Christian hospital, are forced to kill it immediately instead of waiting a few minutes for it to be born. Do you also support the 2-week right-to-kill policy if a new mother changes her mind after birth?

Like so many others, have you placed other issues--size of government, desire for change, freedom from regulation, fears of a theocracy, whatever excuse you want--over the slaughter and dismemberment of children?

 

What a bunch of hyperbole! The hypothetical situations you describe are not what happens. A woman "changing her mind" minutes before a live birth would not be given an abortion. Neither is anyone advocating killing children after birth.

 

But some Christians do advocate killing children prior to birth. And partial birth abortion is most certainly abortion after birth.

 

I'm surprised you think you know "what happens." But partial birth abortion can be and sometimes is done right up until delivery where laws allow. If you don't believe it happens the day of labor, how bout the day before, or the week before? Does that make it better for you? Is a 1-week from birth child easier to kill?

I'm not sure what you mean by the obviously false statement that no one is advocating killing children after birth. This is exactly what some feminists are advocating, both in political and academic circles. The topic has been openly debated by lawmakers in other countries and supporters want this to happen in the U.S., too. Welcome to 3,000 years ago. Infanticide has been legal and encouraged through most of the history of mankind.

 

You may wish to view this thread:

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=46586

 

1) That is a lie. I support giving any aid to Israel that is in the national security interest of these United States.

2) That is a lie. I have no problem whatsoever with Chrisian supporting anti-abortion candidates. What I object to is the claim by some that if one does not do so that one is not a Christian.

 

Good point. While they wouldn't have approved, their message was transforming society by transforming the individual.

 

Story shows that sonograms stop abortions

DENVER (BP)--A Colorado ministry to women in crisis pregnancies recently received a big boost toward its efforts to save human lives -- a new sonogram machine.

http://www.bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?id=27217&ref=BPNews-RSSFeed0118

 

Could you pass? Site tests Roe knowledge

NASHVILLE, Tenn. (BP)--When it comes to Roe v. Wade, Americans are, at best, inconsistent, and at worst, confused.

Polls show that a majority of U.S. adults support the 1973 decision that legalized abortion nationwide while at the same time also backing greater restrictions -- restrictions that Roe, as the courts have interpreted it, prohibits

NASHVILLE, Tenn. (BP)--When it comes to Roe v. Wade, Americans are, at best, inconsistent, and at worst, confused....



http://www.bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?id=27218&ref=BPNews-RSSFeed0118

 

n spite of its impact, true understanding of Roe and what it accomplished remains relatively vague in the public consciousness.

We can expect both sides in the abortion debate to ratchet up arguments in the coming months as we mark this anniversary. It is imperative that we, as citizens, understand the facts about what Roe does and does not do.

We have created the Roe IQ Test to measure the current awareness of Roe and its effects, as well as to provide detailed information about the ruling. It only takes a few minutes to complete the test. Your answers and results will remain 100% confidential.

We hope you will take the IQ Test and invite your friends to do the same. If you think you know Roe, we think you'll be surprised!

Click here to take the Roe IQ Test today.

http://www.roeiqtest.com/ui/

 

How is #1 a lie? You abandon aid to Israel when it becomes, in your view, no longer an issue of direct and immediate security interest to the US. If you believed the modern pre-Trib scenarios, you would be more likely to believe that we as a nation must support Israel at all costs, or God will no longer support us. One is a short term view of US interests, the other is a long term view. And the difference appears to be your rejection of the end-times scenarios so popular now. So I do not see how my statement is untrue, much less a lie. Your stand on Israel is explained at least in part by your eschatology.

How is #2 a lie? You "have no problem" with Christians supporting pro-life candidates? Generous of you. The OP seems to be saying: 1. Christians should speak up to stop the slaughter of children through abortion 2. It is shameful for Christians to support abortion, including by their silence, and possibly he is saying 3. There are wolves among us supporting this agenda of murder and pretending to be Christians. I see no statement that says you are not a Christian if you disagree. While your position seems to be partially pro-choice, it is for reasons of government policy rather than women's rights. Either way, children will be murdered.

Normally I would not pick on someone with enough time and opinion to write nearly 26 thousand posts on this site. But I must ask how you justify the charge that I lied in my post.

 

What Paul and co. did or did not do to stop gladiator contests is not relevant. They did stand up and disobey authorities, both civil and religious, on a regular basis when these authorities disobeyed God's word. The preached when they were commanded not to, they stayed in cities when they were told to leave, they ruined peoples business and livelihood when it was an ungodly profession (idol-making). Jesus Himself went to the temple and rearranged the furniture. Do you think it was legal to show up and knock over tables, scatter their money, and goods, and whip people? (yes I'm aware that some people believe it was the animals being whipped...either way it was not legal)

"Government is not a Christian institution" you say. An odd statement. This is exactly what government is...unless we allow it to become otherwise. God allows us to borrow a bit of his authority to govern ourselves; the least we can do is do so by his commands and guidelines. God's law is perfect; man's law is flawed. Which law should we follow? Some people say "you cannot legislate morality." Well, all laws legislate morality. We believe it is wrong to rape, steal, kill, so there are laws against such things. One way around these laws is to redefine the terms: a child is a "fetus," not a human being, so it is ok to "abort" it, rather than kill it. Any human endeavor, including government, that excludes Christ will not only fail, but have brutal and barbaric consequences.

 

Well said!:thumbs:

 

#1 I put the national security and fiscal health of my country ahead of that of any other country, including Israel. Also, I don't care for pop culture, pop psychology, nor pop eschatology. However, when it is in the national security of these United States to provide military aid to Israel I certainly do support it.

#2 You stated that I "don't agree that Christians should support candidates that will try to outlaw abortion". I never posted any such thing as I have no problem with supporting candidates who are anti-abortion myself. Again, my objection was to the seemingly rhetorical question by steaver that "Is it even remotely possible for a genuine Christian to entertain the very thought of supporting abortion?" which I took to include(since this is the politics forum) voting for candidates who are against government interference in this area and I stated that one can support such candidates even while being a Christian.

 

I've had a lot of time to spend on this board during the past five years while my wife lived with and cared for her ailing mother. However, now that my wife has moved back home my time will be dwindling on this board.

 

Again well said Steaver!:thumbs:

 

1) There is no need to repent of such a vote. It is quite presumptuous for anyone to say such a thing.

2) I would like for all abortions to be outlawed. However, I do not condemn those who vote otherwise.

3) In my opinion, no.