For calvinists: Has God loved every man who ever existed?

Hmmmmmm........ Isaiah 45:7 says God created it in the KJV.

 

What other parts of the bible do you not take literally? I literally think that God creates evil in the form of calamity. What is evil?

 

In its literary form. Don't you? It is appocalyptic literature.

 

I'm a preterist Web. Do you think I don't read Revelation or any other appocalyptic literature as such? By the way, I hate to use the word partial, but that is the common definition of those who do not hold to full preterism. I'm not a full preterist..... but almost

 

I do not deny that God knows all. what I deny is that you know all that God knows. You believe that because God knows it, it will happen as if it makes it happen and we have no choice. Never considering that you have no idea what He knows. Things do not happen because He knows. Things happen and He knows before hand. Scripture never ever says that things happen because God knows it. Which is completely non biblical.

Yes we do have God's word. Try reading it more than one verse at a time.

I admit that it is hard to argue with the truth. I'm only trying to get you to see the truth of scripture. Rather than trying to discern it one verse at a time

I'll say it again. God does not send anyone to hell. Men go there because of there own love for sin. They go to hell because they have ignored God's commandments and ignored His blessed Son.
If we go to Hell it's always because of sin. It's never God's fault.
Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

You can blame God if you want, but it isn't God's fault.
MB

 

Ohh, eschatology. I much to learn in this area. Care to start a thread about it?

 

Hey MB,

What happens if they never heard about Jesus? How will they be judged?

I agree. It's on account of men's sins that anyone is justly punished in hell.

 

I'm in a class on Appocalyptic Literature this semester through Oklahoma Baptist University. It is very interesting. Eschatology is not something I'm an expert on. I'm still in the learning process......... very early stage. About the only eschatology I've studied is what I've gotten from the Bible, and what I've learned about literary context from hermeneutics class. It seems that if an eschatology thread is started in this forum.... it is like starting WWlll. I don't care to start it....... feel free. :laugh:

 

Seeing as how this is off topic, and that I don't want to argue with you, I'll leave it at this MB. You have the last word. God bless.

 

No sir, that's why I asked YOU to start it. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

You first...

 

......... might be fun huh?

 

Man can resist God's will. If that weren't true then by what you believe, God is soley responsible for man's sin and is also the initiator of sin.

We are created in the image of God. God has a will. satan has a will. Man has a will. Angels have a will. Animals have a will.

God's will is perfect. satan's will is always contrary to God's will. Man will either hold to the one and hate the other. Actually I hate the devil becuase no matter how much he tellas me he loves me, I know he hates me!

It's only when a man's will is turned over to God's will is it right, otherwise it is based upon selfishness and that is the very nature of satan.

Man had a life prior to salvation, one that made him a child of wrath. One that was controlled by his sin. You believe that is God's perfect will?


Hogwash!

 

Umm, you'd best do a little more study on that verse. "Evil" in Isaiah 45:7 isn't wickness as you'd like others to believe.

 

God's decrees do not relieve man of his responsibility for the sin that as a free moral agent he chooses, even though God has decreed it to be.
God is the first cause of sin, but He is not the perpetrator of sin. We are the sinners because we act out in sin, God's decrees are not actions of sin and they do not violate any moral law as our sinful actions do.

I heard it explained kind of like this before...
If God decrees that John Doe tries to kill Bob Green and then in trying to kill Bob Green he ends up saving his life, we can see that in God's decree there was no sin because the act from God's standpoint was good. But from John Doe's standpoint it was sin, so he did sin. It is the same way with God decreeing actual sin, it's just that we can't as readily see the good outcome that God has purposed for it. Yet His word tells us that is the case (Rom 8:28)

But our wills are always a slave to our nature.
Nobody would say that God does not have free will, yet He is incapable of sinning. That does not mean that His will is any less free, it means that His will is tied to His nature.

But we must always remember that we do not hold to the false dichotomy of Star Wars (good vs. evil...hopefully good will win). God is in complete control, and it is for good. Even the Devil is God's Devil.

 

Yes, God has loved and does love all people. However God does not love all people the same way. God certainly has a special love for His people that He does not have for those who will never be saved (Jn 17:23, Heb 12:4-11). I would also add that just because God loves a person does not mean that God is obligated to save that person.

 

"Evil" in Isa 45:7 is the Hebrew "ra", which means bad or evil.

It is the same word that is used in...

And out of the ground the LORD God made to spring up every tree that is pleasant to the sight and good for food. The tree of life was in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. (Gen 2:9)

The LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intention of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. (Gen 6:5)

Now the men of Sodom were wicked, great sinners against the LORD. (Gen 13:13)


And many other such passages.