Featured From the foundation of the world

How something is said is also what is said. You're making distinctions where none exist.

 

Good post....good questions.....I.will suggest some more questions for now until I can respond in more detail later.Does God the Father give anyone to the Son?
Does the Son declare anything about those given?
Have you studied the biblical use of the word.....foreknow as it is used in terms of persons not events?
Notice Christians are said to be part of a holy calling....why is that so?

I willrespond in detail and as .much as is necessary as you have sincere questions and not just looking to attack as some do.Truth delights to be investigated.

 

And now my point is proved.

 

No. We are not Calvinists. you know nothing about Primitive Baptists.

all right. I missed that post. I take back what I said.

since when does stating what to one seems obvious become a personal attack ? well, to you, maybe. that one I will not retract.

even when not consulting a greek dictionary, and simply looking at creating a building, when you lay a foundation is when you lay a foundation, and not any other time AFTER the act. Everything involved in laying the foundation, from measuring its depth and length and breadth to the erection and laying of the reinforcement bars, to the pouring of concrete is all ONE act of laying a foundation. There is no other act after this that can be called a laying of foundation.
This is one act of casting down, of putting on the ground, of laying the foundation. There is no continous founding of the world, which is what I gather you are implying.

says who ? you ?

okay. I'll pass on this one.

Huh ?

And I suppose you are the one who will translate this correctly ?

give us a demonstration, then. translate it correctly.

but let me say this.
the author of the book of life is the ETERNAL GOD.
now, I don't know, maybe you have some dictionary that says otherwise.
if you and I both believe that there is an actual physical book in heaven, we might as well go have our heads examined.
More learned commentators have said the BOOK is the mind of God.
If you say that names are continually being written in the book (mind) by God, then are you saying God has standards by which he decides whether a man/woman's name
is to be written down ? or that He has not made up His mind ? or that certain events influence His decisions ?

 

Seriously RM, how do you see this as a slant? I see it as a very direct question that you either answer as a "yes, thats how I see it as well" or you beg to differ & post your interpretation.

So here is the question again...... can you answer it in the same direct way it was posted? Thank you.

"How else can you read these verses that makes any sense? They are quite clear and straightforward'"

 

If he wants me to give an explanation of those verses then he can give one himself. Another thing cals do post scripture, give no explanation on how they see it and demand others do the opposite of what they do. It is a debate game and tactic and is shameful. Be straightfoorward and upfront. Makes sure people understand you and drop all this elitist mind games.

And by the way the only reason you jumped in here is because Icon is a cal. Period. More elitist games.

It is just plain arrogant when you believe it is below you to have to explain how you understand a passage.

 

You are off the rails........ you either debate someone or shutup. This Elitist Games nonscience card that your playing shows you have deep seated resentments & your bound and determined to vent them......that is very disappointing coming from someone claiming Christ as their Lord. You want to be fair, then start with your own actions. Right now, you have just tarnished your rep & I dont even think you are aware of it. From now on I will disregard any of your phony baloney Dudley Do-right activities ..... they are NOT genuine.

 

Exactly!

I see the attack anti-cal is still sowing discord, name calling and broad brushing. This is nearly daily for him to ad nauseum. Time for him to hit the ignore list. :thumbs:

 

As Pinoy said earlier, and with no slant or insult to you or anyone practicing Calvinism, I do not consider myself a Calvinist, nor do I consider myself reformed. Nor am I attempting to deceive anyone because I do believe in DoG / sovereign Grace soteriology.

That being said, there is a discernible negative tenor against those who support Calvinism to a degree that I am not sure some people harboring them are consciously aware of....and this shows itself sometimes in backhanded remarks. Yes I know that there are a number of contentious remarks from both camps bounced around here (and I am guilty of them as well) but there is a difference from being snippy & really being down right insulting...... for example this comment is specifically meant to be nasty; Calvinism is a doctrine of disgrace". Anyway you cut it, those are fighting words (and they are nasty & unnecessary). I dont know how anybody, Calvinist & Non-Calvinist can even talk to the guy after that.

 

Yes, we get labelled Calvinist, but ftr I consider myself 'reformed' or holding to DoG, but the label is what it is.

Brother, what we see above in the ad nauseum attack anti-cal is nothing short of stalking, causing division and sowing discord. Nothing really is used as proof or as timely evidence, instead it's plainly and simply broad-brushed stalking from thread to thread from the same culprit.

 

Your theory and straw man example was thoroughly rebutted in post #13 to which you have no answer, not to mention your OP was a classic personal attack, and some have called you on this.

 

Revmitchell

The only thing you prove is you are unable and unwilling to respond and actually offer a proof.

 

Sapper Woody

Hello SW.This sounds good.We should have this attitude concerning any doctrine:wavey: let's take a look

A cal pauses right here.....Do you mean Omniscience? Or Biblical Foreknowledge? As this has taken place before creation it does not

speak to the events per se, but rather the persons involved.

For WHOM he did foreknow.....is those sinners that God elected to salvation.

to them who are the called according to his purpose.

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

This discussion starts with the knowledge that God knows the end from the beginning,and as such never needs to learn anything or make plans based on what man will or will not do.God does not "need" to look ahead and see what will happen, then adjust His plan because he already has purposed in Himself to accomplish redemption.
18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

You will "see it" if you study the passages in ISA.40-54 concerning the person and work of The Servant of The Lord.

The Elect Servant comes to accomplish a covenant redemption for all that are in the covenant. The elect remnant of national Israel and then the elect gentiles are included.

I do not see where the Promise was to...THE WORLD??? Could you explain what you mean by that? Did you mis-read it? it says before the world was.

Because some oppose it...it does matter indeed.

:thumbs:great, praise the Lord for His mercy.

Yes it does.God saves...He is not just a spectator.When you say "or just knew beforehand....it is not consistent with the biblical revelation.

The eternal destiny of all In Christ is certain.It matters in our gospel presentation however.

 

Sapper Woody

The context of Jesus High Priestly prayer is Jesus IN UNION with His people.
When He died...we died...as he lives we live.God loves sinners...IN CHRIST.

Good...I have no 'choice" as far as a stance as this truth is all through scripture when you see it.

SW...as time permits....list 4-5 of these obvious arguments and we can take a look.

My job so to speak is to give you much more to prayerfully consider:thumbs:

 

My apologies, I did misread the passage. I will be posting more after I do some studying, and am at my computer where I can see more posts as I respond. On my phone, I can only see my response, including any quotes I have.