Genesis 3:15, Luke 4:4 - Gnostic?

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Have you bought a copy of Green's book, Michelle? If not, don't you care enough to know and find out the truth?
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Actually, I don't doubt what Askjo has said, and do not need to read this book for understanding it, as I already see and understand this. If I didn't, yes, if I cared enouph to learn more about it, I just might. But many of you have shown that you really do not care. Because many seem to only desire to argue, I can understand why he wouldn't be so forthcoming, as I also would not. The Lord tells us not to cast our pearls before swine. I am not calling you swine, so please do not misunderstand me, but it has been made obvious that you all do not really care anyway. There is no genuine desire to learn being expressed here. If there was, Askjo would probably share it. Why share something, and go through all that work, when many just do not care at all? He has done his job, and has not only warned you all, but given you the resources to research this yourself, if you really do care to learn more about it.


love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

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But Askjo, you just said that you disagree with them on many things. The question was *not* whether you agree with them here or disagree there, but whether you have some verification standard which allows you to tell when these people speak error or truth, since you yourself admit that their writings are partial truth mixed with partial error.
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If this is your accusation, then I think it is up to you to show this. Not Askjo. He gave you the information, the rest is up to you, if you really care about it. He has already explained to you, that he agrees in part with them, and others he doesn't. I am the same way. There are many that share the truth, but there are other things they might believe that I don't agree with. I do not think it is possible to ever find someone that agrees on all points in everything, and if one does, this is a very rare thing.


love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

Michelle: "There is no genuine desire to learn being expressed here. If there was, Askjo would probably share it."

The genuine desire here is to see whether Askjo relies on a truth-telling source, particularly since he himself has admitted that many of his sources are mixtures of truth and error, and there seems to be no method for distinguishing truth from error. This simply is an attempt to apply Jude 22-23 and James 5:19-20 and to promote truth above error when citing various sources of known questionable value.

To restate the question clearly: *how* can you tell when a known erroneous source is telling the truth? For most of us, the solution would be to discard those source materials which contain a high degree of error and seek out something that is more correct. Askjo admits that he isn't doing that, but apparently picks and chooses "truth" according to whether he happens to agree or not with what a writer happens to say. This is *not* a solution.

Michelle: "If this is your accusation, then I think it is up to you to show this."

I already did show the documentable errors in the Stewart source Askjo cited with such authority. I would be happy to verify whatever Green might have said *if* Askjo would simply quote something from Green's book instead of telling us to buy it (and I already have my copy, as previously mentioned, thank you).

Michelle: ". I do not think it is possible to ever find someone that agrees on all points in everything"

This is not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing with someone's opinion. It is a matter of *how* one can distinguish truth when a source is known to contain various types of error.

 

What a double standard. First she says to buy the book, then she says she sees no need for HERSELF to buy the book. Duh! Continued circular reasoning.

AVL1984

 

Are you a liar to buy your PC and pay monthy payment for your ISP? Sell your PC and buy Jay's book! </font>[/QUOTE]Nope. My PC is very old and I don't have internet. I use public library computers for internet use or someone elses. I looked at local library and it doesn't have book. I may check local college library, but from what I've seen the selection of religeous books there is very small compared to all the other stuff they have.

 

Plus, I won't buy a book just because someone says so. It would be like me telling someone who was asking about Jesus to demand they go get a movie and then ridicule them if they didn't - which is what Askjo is doing. That is not sharing the truth in love. I don't care how you try and spin it.

 

This thread has REALLY gone downhill - fighting about buying a book?!?

 

I did some searching and found this direct quote from the book.

“Upon studying certain portions of the Scriptures, the author was appalled, thoroughly shocked, when it was found that the NASB and NIV, supposedly ‘conservative’ translations, had eliminated such a noted testimony to the Deity of Christ as God manifest in the flesh. Other new versions were searched to see if they did this also. The following pages reveal the more extensive studies that were made to discover how the new versions treat the deity of Christ.

Such notable Gnostic corruptions as that in Matthew 19:16‑19, where the Scriptures were altered to make Christ deny His own goodness, have been resurrected and inserted into nine of the new versions. And this in spite of the fact that the many words the new versions have cast out of Matthew appear intact in Mark 10:17, 18 and Luke 18:18, 19. This, of course, puts a direct contradiction within the new versions. Further study turned up Ebionite, Manachean, and other heretical beliefs being reinserted into new versions. Among other things, the virgin birth, the sinlessness, the omnipresence, and other essential doctrines testifying to Christ as God have been changed or denied in the new versions."

In other words, it is nothing new and nothing that hasn't already been shown to be false.

 

Scott,

You didn't need to do that -- we were waiting for Askjo to give us the evidence directly instead of dancing and spinning and telling us to buy the book.....

Of course, given this quote, I wonder whether Green had ever read *any* of the "real" Gnostic, Ebionite, Manichaean, and other heretical" writings, which are readily available at any good Bible College or Seminary library.

And if so, I wonder whether Green ever noticed that *none* of the heretical corruptions of NT texts that appear in their own writings have *ever* made it into *any* of the Greek MSS of the NT, whether of Alexandrian type or some other.

Inability to deal with facts. Sad.

 

Here is the crux of the problem with your statement---Askjo has not said anything!

We have been trying for the last several pages to get him to say something.

You again show your blind allegience to those who agree with you even though you don't know what they are talking about, because they haven't said anything.

How can one know what one has said if one has not said anything? Gnostic?

Bro Tony

 

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Here is the crux of the problem with your statement---Askjo has not said anything!
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He has said alot, and offered alot. Haven't you read all the posts? It is you who is requiring of him to give you MORE than what he desires to give (with good reason), and then badgering him because of it. You are being argumentative. I recommend you drop it, and stop trying to slander fellow brothes and sisters in Christ Jesus.
Your demands are not being met, and you have been explained why they have not. Be a good christian man, and drop it for sake of peace. If you really desire to know, go research it more yourself.


love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

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You again show your blind allegience to those who agree with you even though you don't know what they are talking about, because they haven't said anything.

How can one know what one has said if one has not said anything? Gnostic?
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And you are again false accusing me, and lying about me. Please stop it. I said I agree and understand the issue in this thread. I never said I agreed with some man's opinion in a book, that I have never read.


love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

Apparently you don't understand as well as you say you understand. My post had no reference to your agreeing with the book, but you blindly agreeing with Askjo although he hasn't said anything.

Yes I have read the whole thread. Askjo has said nothing except "buy the book. He does not have to discuss anything if he chooses not to. If that is his choice then he should not bring up things on a "discussion" board. I sure you know what that word means.

As far as you ad homenim attacks on my actions as to whether or not I am acting like a Christian. I would suggest you remove a large log in your own eye, before you worry about what is in another's eye.

Bro Tony

 

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Yes I have read the whole thread. Askjo has said nothing except "buy the book. He does not have to discuss anything if he chooses not to. If that is his choice then he should not bring up things on a "discussion" board. I sure you know what that word means.

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Okay, since this is a continuation of the other thread, include that other thread also. This is what I was refering to. Yes, he brought these things to your attention. Askjo has decided not to answer anymore your bullying questions. Figure it out yourself, and ask the Lord to show you.


love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

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As far as you ad homenim attacks on my actions as to whether or not I am acting like a Christian. I would suggest you remove a large log in your own eye, before you worry about what is in another's eye.

Bro Tony
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I did not do any of the above. This is what I said to you:


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Be a good christian man, and drop it for sake of peace. If you really desire to know, go research it more yourself.
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Love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

The same way you libel brothers and sisters in Christ, Michelle, saying they are deceived, questioning their salvation, their service to God, and their intelligence? Get real, deary. Get real.

AVL1984

 

When will the nightmare end?

Michelle, you speak about the book in one thread then when corrected you say you meant you were refering to what Askjo said. There is no having a coherent conversation with you for you change you words with the blowing of the wind. I guess it would be wise of me not to try.

Bro Tony