Government Surveillance Cameras on Every Street Corner?

So which is worse, the ACLU or the SBC?

 

Move to England and find out where the Bill of Rights do not exist.

 

Ken,

You didn't answer the question at all, much less clearly. You made an irrelevant statement that we agree on.

The topic here (per the OP) was about freedom and surveillance cameras, not about the government knowing what you are doing when you haven't committed a crime.

How does having a surveillance camera on a street corner affect your freedom? Is it limiting to you? What is it taking away from you?

If you don't have a legitimate answer, that's fine. Perhaps someone else does.

How is this different than having a policeman on every corner? Is that limiting your freedom as well?

Perhaps someone here would like to discuss the real issue.

 

Or perhaps someone here could save me the money and effort and just answer it.

 

Maybe the issue is what I am doing is nobody's business vs freedoms guaranteed in the Constitution, unless you infer from the Constitution the right of privacy. I cannot say that a camera directly affects my freedoms under the Bill of Rights. However, from a common sense standpoint, unless a crime is being planned or committed, I do not want some inept government official know what I am doing every minute. Still, your question might be answered by saying it affects my freedom to the right of privacy.

 

It is way too late for this, KenH. This is already happening, and there is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING you can do to stop it.

Regards,
BiR

 

Does anyone take Rudy seriously? He brings nothing to the table.
Here's a fun game: whenever he is debating, speaking, etc., count how many times he makes mention of 9/11 or A-Q.

:laugh:
We will always have room for you over here on the left!

Hope all is well,
BiR

 

I do think what I do is nobody's business, but when it happens in public it is. It is someone's business if I were to urinate on a public sidewalk, although I might wish to claim privacy for such a moment. I don't know about the right of privacy in the constitution. I understand there are people who take both sides, but i don't know enought to comment on that.

But I wonder how we can claim a right to privacy on a public sidewalk? We are in public afterall.

I would tend to agree, which is why I wonder why Ken thinks differently.

How would they know if a plan is being planned or committed unless they are looking? I think the issue of being a public place changes the nature of the debate. If this were a camera directed at someone's home, or an individual's workplace or some such, I would be more concerned. I am not sure how concerned I should be that it is on a public street corner aimed at no one in particular.

That's reasonable enough ... I still wonder about what I mentioned above, as well as the comparison with a police officer sitting there. How is this materially different than a police officer sitting on the corner watching?

 

In general, I agree. What makes people uncomfortable is the dishonesty and lack of a moral or any other compass that our leaders have exhibited as of late. The most recent example I can think of is a President, running as a conservative, and republican senators running as conservatives, and turning right around and teaming up with the likes of Kennedy to sponser the immigration bill, and the congressmen going to jail.

 

Do you believe that the sidewalk urination problem is so huge that it warrants a multimillion dollar surveilance system that would effectively enable 'them' to watch every move you make in public? They would be able to know when you left your house, where you went, how long you stayed, who you talked to on the way. This is not the type of information I would trust the government with. This is the type of information that the communists would imprison and torture people to obtain, so they could gather more people to imprison and torture.

 

But they really only want these omnipresent electronic eyes to protect us. Yeah, right.

 

This is no big deal. Every time you go to the grocery store, Wal-Mart, Target, a mall, an ATM, a public library, just about any public place, you are being filmed on security cameras, whether you are in the facility or in the parking lot. Get a grip. This is not a privacy issue unless you are being filmed in your private residence.

 

Pastor Larry is asking the same question that I asked on page 1.

How is having a security camera in place on a given corner any different than the city placing a police officer on that corner? Would we be complaining about that?

 

Several things, the UK (England as a part of) is the original land of the free and home of the brave. When USA black troops came over in WWII they loved the freedom, some US officers wanted the British to implement segregation here but we would not.

ANyway, that is by the by.

I think the CCTV issue is a rabbit trail. It is not the technology, but the use of the technology that frightens. On paper it seems like a good idea, and initially I am sure it would be. The anti-crime potential is tremendous. What people fear is not the technology, nor what it would be used for initially but what it would be used for ultimately. It is the potential use that frightens people.

In the UK they estimate that you get caught on CCTV an average of 300 times a day! Now, my freedoms are no way affected... unless in the future I get an ID card with an RFID that constantly triggers cameras to snap onto registered baptists...

I think the fear is not the initial use nor the technology, but its potential use.

 

Also, the people using it. Since when can we trust the government to do exactly what they say they will do and nothing more?

Of course, I suppose if they really wanted to know my whereabouts all day long, they would already have surveillance people/equipment following me around, so a few more fixed cameras wouldn't hurt me in that situation.

 

And people (cops, in this case) are capable of lying. On a jury, people are probably about as likely to believe the testimony of a police officer as they are a video tape, so I can't see the difference there.

Maybe we should each take cameras and everyone just record themselves.

 

If you note the context, my remark was about a specific comment. They are already able to watch every move I make in public.

They can already know this information.

So I fail to see how this is a freedom issue, so far.

 

Can anyone really trust the goverment to use surveillance cameras solely for the purpose of fighting crime? I also don't appreciate efforts by the government taking away my privacy in the guise of protecting me.

 

There is still a barrier between the government and the information, and in many cases it would require warrants to obtain the video. The police cannot just walk into any establishment and demand their video tapes (although I'm sure they do it every day).

It is a tool to take away our freedom. Just as the gun control freaks recognize that guns are essential to shooting people, I recognize that tracking people is a tool for controling where people go and what they do. Cameras on every street corner may not be a direct assault on your freedom, but what is done with the cameras may be. It comes down to weighing the pros and cons, and in my view I find the possible positive uses are not sufficient to overcome the probable negative uses. History has shown over and over that governments cannot be trusted.