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Featured Have we turned the sinner's prayer into a sacrament???

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by lanman87, Jan 6, 2021.

  1. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yet another you, you, you post of false charges. Rightly understood scripture tells what we should think.

    We are trying to follow Christ, thus growing more like Christ in our walk, and in order to do that we must evaluate our walk, confess our shortcomings, and strive to do better.

    We are to listen to our indwelt Spirit as we evaluate our walk.

    John 14:26
    “But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.

    John 16:8
    “And He, when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment;

    1) Progressive sanctification requires that we evaluate our walk, confess our missteps and strive to follow Christ every day.

    2) How often should we test ourselves to see if we are of the faith? Who is saved, those that endure for a little while, or those who endure to the end? How do we know we are enduring to the end if we ignore our walk and engage in lawlessness?

    3) The issue is not what I "make it out to be" but what scripture teaches.

    Luke 9:23
    And He was saying to them all, “If anyone wishes to come after Me, he must deny himself, and take up his cross daily and follow Me.

    Galatians 6:4
    But each one must examine his own work, and then he will have reason for boasting in regard to himself alone, and not in regard to another.

    1Thessalonians 5:21
    But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good;
     
  2. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    If all a person needs to do is say the sinner's prayer, that then results in being automatically saved, then yes, that turns of sinners prayer into the action on our part that obtains God's grace. This would be advocated by the Easy Believism advocates who believe if you profess belief in Christ you are "automatically" saved. It is of course, nonsense. We are saved when God alone places us spiritually into Christ. And God does that when He credits our faith as righteousness (or not). The people of Matthew 7 professed belief yet were not saved. The second and third soils of Matthew 13 professed belief yet were not saved.

    After we are placed into Christ, our positional sanctification, then we strive to follow the leading of our indwelt Spirit, who works to aid us, Philippians 2:13, as we strive to earn rewards as we serve Christ.
     
  3. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    ... and only you "rightly understand" scripture.
    We comprehend your message and disagree with its content.
    [Hence all of the "you, you, you" responses.]
     
  4. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    Whether true or not, it is irrelevant to progressive sanctification which is what your post and my response was about ... and both are irrelevant to the OP, so "whatever" ... you win.
     
  5. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Did I say I am the only one who rightly understands scripture? Of course not. They make up false charges and spew them non-stop.
     
  6. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Note my post was edited to remove the following:
    After we are placed into Christ, our positional sanctification, then we strive to follow the leading of our indwelt Spirit, who works to aid us, Philippians 2:13, as we strive to earn rewards as we serve Christ.
     
  7. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    No, you just say that everyone who disagrees with you is wrong and then play the victim (like in this post).

    [Poor Van ... so mistreated and misunderstood.]
     
  8. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    So noted.
    Note that progressive sanctification is still OFF-TOPIC from the OP and GOD is still the one who does the Progressive Sanctifying (per Philippians 2:13).
     
  9. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    You you you yet again, false teachers cannot present truth so they present disinformation non-stop.
    I say the bible means what it says.
    When we are sealed with the Holy Spirit, we are sealed forever, thus we can never be separated from Christ.
     
  10. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    I don't understand why so many hate the sinners prayer. It is not a Catholic position as if they are the inventor of the Christian religion. It is not Calvinist position. It seems people hate it simply because they are asking God to forgive them of there sins and save them. People who hate it so severely wish to stop this salvation process. In my opinion the hatred of it is Satanic..
    Jas_4:2 Ye lust, and have not: ye kill, and desire to have, and cannot obtain: ye fight and war, yet ye have not, because ye ask not.
    MB
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Right, whoever introduced Philippians 2:13 was off topic.
    God and the born anew believer work together, and if not, the believer does not follow the Holy Spirit's leading.
     
  12. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    That stuff will destroy your brain, brother.
    I never said anything contrary to eternal security ... as a 5 point Calvinist, I completely agree with the (P) Preservation of the Saints in TULIP.

    You were the one that claimed:
    • WE TRY
    • WE EVALUATE
    • WE CONFESS
    • WE STRIVE TO DO BETTER
    ... so WE are the ones that can succeed or fail.

    I was the one that claimed:

    [Philippians 2:13 NASB] 13 for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for [His] good pleasure.
    • GOD IS AT WORK
    • GOD CREATES IN US THE DESIRE TO OBEY
    • GOD EMPOWERS US TO OBEY
    • GOD DOES THIS BECAUSE HE WANTS TO!
    ... so GOD is the one that must succeed or fail, and God never fails.

    [HOWEVER NONE OF THIS HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE OP.]
     
    #112 atpollard, Jan 14, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2021
  13. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    I think it is less about hating the prayer than concern over its misuse.

    For the OP, the concern is that one CANNOT BE SAVED without saying the right prayer, the right way, or believing that the Prayer Itself saved you rather than who the prayer is spoken to that (Jesus) that saved you.

    For myself, I am more concerned that people might mistake the prayer for the end of a journey (the Finish Line) rather than the beginning of a relationship (the start of a race/courtship).

    Honestly, there are a lot of things that the members tend to take too seriously or too lightly. When a 3 year old is drinking grape juice from a disposable cup, the "wine" has come to mean too little and when people think that drinking that cup will save them, it has come to mean too much.
     
  14. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Now, after posting non-stop denial, he agrees with every point I made in post #14. :)
     
  15. lanman87

    lanman87 Member

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    I never said anything about hating the sinners prayer. Saying a prayer of belief, thanksgiving, confession, repentance and asking for help in living out the new belief is the natural first act of someone who comes to faith.

    My questions is more about the fact that it seems we have almost turned the "sinner's prayer" into a sacrament or ritual by which we are saved instead of an expression of belief/faith as worded by a new believer.
     
  16. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Which is when the amusing "taint so" are sent!
     
  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    When we have it as "asking Jesus into your heart" as the prayer, and do not really inform the person on what a commitment to Jesus as Lord and savior means, is when we get many who delude themselves as now saved due to a one time altar call!
     
  18. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    "What must I do to be saved?" (acts 16:30)

    A simple, common, straightforward question.
    How would YOU answer it?
     
  19. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    "What must I do to be saved?" (acts 16:30)

    A simple, common, straightforward question.
    How would YOU answer it?
     
  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Same way Paul answered the jailer!
     
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