Have you ever Spoken in Tounges

Sorry, but I think they are talking about "Tongues" as spoken through an individual, by the Spirit of God. Unlearned tongues....as the Spirit of God gives the utterance.

MEE

 

Actually, MEE, I think YOU need to go back and re-read the references you provided me.

The apostle Paul NEVER made any distinction between "the gift of tongues" and the gift of tongues resulting from the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

You're going to have to show me through the passages provided in that reference and the ones we've all been through many times before where Paul indicates that there's a difference between the two.

 

Don, I think the link explains it very well. I couldn't do any better.

Possibly you need to read it again and see the difference. You won't find a person that speaks in tongues, for the first time, say that they received the "gift of tongues." Even your charismatics will say that they received the "Baptism of the Holy Ghost," -not the "Gift of tongues."

They are both of the Spirit, but used differently. Receiving the Holy Ghost is a must, the "gift of tongues" is one of the nine spiritual gifts and not required for salvation.

I really don't know what else to tell you. See if you can find some of the other topics on tongues and maybe there will be something there that better explains things to you. I appreciate your desire to learn.

MEE

 

But MEE -- that link DOES NOT show a difference, in the apostle Paul's writing, between the two.

It may show a difference, albeit no actual distinction, in the two between the book of Acts and some of Paul's writings. But Paul didn't write the book of Acts. In the books that Paul did write, we can find no distinction between the two.

That's where I need you to show me the distinction: in Paul's writings. Leave out the book of Acts, since it wasn't written by Paul. Leave out the Old Testament books, since they weren't written by Paul. Look at only the books written by Paul, and tell me where Paul makes a distinction between the gift of tongues and the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

 

Tounges? No. (Amen to everything Briguy has said on this thread on topic)

Brain drain slain pain? No. Attended 'Churches' like that for a while and took a catch one night, have since repented

Healed? Every Christian has been

Pete

 

I know exactly what he was talking about, but I am speaking of the scriptural use of tongues.

Acts 2:4And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
5And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. 6Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.

 

(MEE - Quote)

I see this as evidence of receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost.
A person has to have His Spirit and has to know when he/she receives
the Spirit of God. Tongues is that sign!

Peter said that it was for as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Brian, He is still calling. Right?

The sign will end at the end of the NT Church age.

(Singer)

My experience and understanding is identical to that of MEE.

(Don - Quote)

And yet Paul specifically tells us that tongues are a sign for unbelievers....
Funny how I never seem to get a response to that statement....

(Singer)

Unbelievers of what....? Maybe it's those unbelievers who do not believe
in the baptism of the Holy Ghost evidenced by tongues. .
Remember my thread on tongues where I warned not to pray diligently in
the confines of your own home, not to expect answers from God, not to read
the bible in great expectation, not to allow the spirit to flow.....etc. ?

The result.................Tongues speaking could happen to you !!!

*"But I DONT LIKE TOMATOES, Mommy"
"Have you tried them" ?
NO

 

Thanks Singer! I love people with common sense.

Try it, you'll like it!

MEE

 

MEE, I tried going to strip bars once upon a time, too (before I was saved); I liked that as well.

Should I give it another try?

AGAIN, please show exactly where Paul makes a distinction between the gift of tongues and the gift of tongues from being baptized by the Holy Ghost.

I'm assuming at this point that you can't.

 

Actually Don, does human nature die upon conversion to Christianity?

 

First, you'll have to explain to me what human nature has to do with the entire conversation.

MEE posted "try it; you might like it" as a means of supporting speaking in tongues. I simply posted a pre-conversion analogy to show the fallacy of that logic (not saying I'm logical; most of the time, I'm far from from it).

Now, if either you or MEE would like to show me the passages, written by Paul, that show where Paul acknowledges a difference between the gift of tongues and the gift of tongues when baptized by the Holy Ghost, I'll be happy to evaluate it with an open mind.

 

Don:

Using the Search service of this board, there is a multitude of info
on the issue of tongues and the differences you seek.

http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi

The last one ended up being a 29 page discussion..not need to
repeat it again.

As for addressing the ''human nature'' topic, wasn't it you who said:
"MEE, I tried going to strip bars once upon a time, too (before I was
saved); I liked that as well." ?

Singer

 

Please don't be obtuse. I explained why I made that statement. If you need further explanation, then by all means, ask for it.

The previous tongues threads, of which I have participated, never answered my question--to my knowledge. I have not been able to find any of Paul's writings that indicated his belief that there is a difference between the gift of tongues and the gift of tongues when baptized by the Holy Ghost. If you know of a particular thread, or a particular passage, that proves otherwise, then by all means, please share it.

 

Thanks Titus.

Singer, as for "unbelievers" Paul says that clearly. He quotes Isaiah right while he is talking about tongues being a sign to unbelievers. The quote from Isaiah says something to the effect of "to this people" and that of course is a reference to the people of Isreal, therefore by no stretch what-so-ever we must conclude that the unbelievers that Paul has in mind our the unbeleiving Jews.

Carol and Singer, you two seem like great people, Lots of passion fo our Lord. Please read the verses in 1 Cor 14 and Isaiah 28 (I think thats the reference) and see if you can see the conclusion I come to, in the scripture. Thanks!!

In Christ,
Brian

 

Don, why are you so upset?

I don't know what you are after, but I can't show you something in the way that you are asking without adding to the Word. Paul, to my knowledge, doesn't talk about the two subjects in any one verse or chapter.

As you know, the Bible doesn't read like a novel. One has to link the scriptures together to get the meaning of a lot of things.

Let's put it this way! The church, at Corinth, was set up in Acts the eithteenth chapter. They received the *Baptism of the Holy Ghost* which is evidenced by speaking in tongues, like on the Day of Pentecost.

In this we are talking about receiving the Spirit of God. Tongues is not the issue..only the evidence.

Paul, in the 12th chapter of Corinthians talks about the gifts of the Spirit. The two, gift of tongues and the interpretation of tongues, go together when used of God. They have nothing to do with receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost. Yes, they all are of God but are of different definitions.

In other words, you don't say, "Have you received the gift of tongues when you received the baptism of the Holy Ghost." The gift of tongues is not the baptism of the Holy Ghost.

I hope this explains what you don't understand. If not, I really don't know how to explain it any better. Try the link again and maybe it will be of a better understanding now.

www.apostolic.edu/biblestudy/

MEE

 

Don,

I guess I'm amazed and perplexed at the same time over the issue of how
any topic can become so clear to a person through prayer and study....
only to be totally devasted by someone else.

Actually there is no personal gain to me for you to see the baptism of the
Holy Spirit through my eyes. I'm pleased that Carol has also come to the
same understanding that I have. The "Tongues" thread highlighted my initial
thoughts in my first post. As you may remember, I have not spoken in tongues
since that time some near 25 years ago, but it was a glorious experience.

There are posters here who I have the hightest esteem for but who do not
respect my experience with that issue. Again, it amazes me that there must
be 10,000 topics to make conclusion on during one's life and we may never
run into another person who has the same understanding on all 10,000.

Possibly I would be better off for not have been exposed to so many
different thoughts. Whether the Holy Spirit comes automatically when we
first believe or whether it's a second work of God....maybe that's
unimportant. But for me, I prayed diligently, received what I did and if
I have to go back and discount it as from satan, then I'll have to doubt
alot more that I presently hold as truth about God.

Singer

 

Briguy:

Of course there's much more to it, but in reference to 1 Cor 14:4 for instance:

"He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself."
That's what happened to me during what I call the baptism of the H.S.
The edification has lasted 25 years. Paul said in vs 5...."I would that ye
all spoke with tongues". The fact that he said ..."but rather that ye
prophesy" does not discount the fact that he also said " I would that ye
all spoke with tongues".

1Cor14:18 says "I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all".

Some posters here wish to think that all gifts have ceased. That's even
a new approach to me. That might make topic 10,001. And then some
wonder why I can't find a church to join ......????

Per my experience with prayer; if I were to discount each truth that I
know because someone else had a differing opinion, I'm sure I could
find enough people to completely destroy my faith in God.

For instance, could you join me in a bar, singing tunes by Waylon Jennings
and Alan Jackson and then witness to someone 5 minutes later while sipping
on a beer ? Does God have a need for someone to do that ?

Singer

 

Hi Singer

you wrote ""He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself."

Yes, Paul wrote that and was saying thats what people were doing and shouldn't. This is a negative statement Paul was making because people edifying themselves directly violates what he just said in 1 cor 12:7, that is that "gifts" are for the common good. If a person speaks in tongues to themselves and are edified they have violated scripture. This is one main reason I believe the Baptism of the Holy Ghost concept is in some fellowships, because it allows for self-edification whereas scripture related to spiritual gifts does not allow it.


As for your question about singing, I would never drink a beer and sing Waylon Jenning songs.

A root beer and some John Denver or Simon and Garfunkel and I may join you

In Christ,
Brian

 

Paul made a distinction in I Corinthians the 12th Chapter and 1 Corinthians 14. If you will notice
Paul was speaking about the 9 gifts of the spirit. The gift of tongues is #8 and the gift of interpretation of tongues is #9.

Paul in chapter 14th declares that when you speak in tongues you are speaking unto God mysteries and the person who is speaking in tongues will be strenghtened personally in the Lord. Paul spoke emphatically about praying in tongues or praying in the spirit. These tongues are mysterious between the person and God. Tongues with interpretation is a supernatural manifestation for the edification of the church. So yes Paul does show a distinction but a person has to really pay attention closely to the scriptures.

The Bible says that tongues are a sign to unbelievers. Not just Jews but all sinners. It is a supernatural manifestation that shows God's glory and power. The tongues are to convince unbelievers of God's power.

When the 120 received the Holy Ghost they spoke in tongues. When the gentiles received the Holy Ghost they spoke in tongues. Why? It was a sign to believing Jews that the Gentiles had received the same measure of God's spirit. At this time the only unbelievers were the Gentiles present.

 

Brian:

Root beer has too much sugar. Beer is actually nourishing and good
for your circulation, well being and good for your heart. My cousins are
related to Waylon so I'm partial...hope you can understand that.
Besides....who can dance to John Denver anyhow.?

Nah...I don't see it that way at all.
How could they violate scripture when Paul said "What is it then" ?
His resolution was in verse 15 of 1 Cor 14:

" I will pray with the spirit AND I will pray with the understanding also"

Do you think Paul would have violated scripture....?
Heck man he WROTE IT...!!!

In vs 18 Paul thanked God that he spoke in tongues and you say it's
violating scripture ???

Long live country music.!!