He Did Away Withy The Law

This is all completely true. We are absolutely not saved by obeying the law and neither Bill nor I have ever suggested such a thing.

However, 'What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not! Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one's slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness?
But God be thanked that though you were slaves of sin, yet you obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine to which you were delivered.
And having been set free from sin you became slaves of righteousness' (Rom 6:15-18).

Shall we be slaves of God and slaves to righteousness and yet not keep God's righteous commandments? Again I ask, which of the commandments don't you want to keep? Is not the law written on your heart (Heb 10:16)? If you think Heb 10:16 doesn't apply to you, why do you think verse 17 does?

'For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome' (1 John 5:3).

Steve

 

I agree with this. I think it very significant that he and Aaron were among the majority that could not enter into the land of milk & honey, but perished in the wilderness.

 

Think the point of contention on this OP is that while its true that we should be saved by God, and live unto Christ in our new lives, we do not see that God has us under the law has in Old Covenant relationship, but now in the new Covenant relationship, we are to be living in the person/power of the Holy Spirit in us, as that will eet thre requirements for God towards us today!

Stay abiding in Chrsit and His word, by power of the HS, so focus on that, and not in rigid keeping of the Law!

 

1. Surely the new covenant relationship that we have with God is that the law is written on our hearts (Jer 31:31ff; Heb 8:8ff)?

How rigid should we be in our keeping of the Ten Commandments? Is a touch of idolatry all right? Can we dishonour our parents just a little bit? Commit adultery just occasionally? Abide in Christ by all means; walk in the Spirit most certainly, but if anyone thinks that the Spirit is telling him to break one of the Commandments, then I beg leave to doubt that it's the Spirit of God he's walking in.

Steve

 

Brother,

I am sorry if you thought I thought that you believed in keeping the Law. I knew this, but I guess my posts came across a little too "fuzzy" and not nice and clear like I hoped they would.


Here are a couple passage for you and Brother Steve to chew on:

They were shut up unto the faith until Christ came and fulfilled the Law. The Law is finito, adios amigos, bonvoyage, bye bye baby, etc. We are now under Grace.

We now live under the two Great Commandments that Jesus gave us. These are the Laws that God places in our hearts, not the ten engraved on tables of stone. If we love the Lord with all our heart, soul, mind, and strength, and love our neighbors as ourself, then we are observing the Laws that God placed in our hearts.

 

what I am saying that by abiding in Christ, through applying His word in the power of the HS , will fulfill the requirements of the law for today, as he will allow us to live as we should be!

law without Grace is legalism, while Grace without the control of the HS is our flesh trying to fullfil the law!

 

Great passages! I'm sorry not to have got back to you by now. It may be a couple of days before I can.

If I deal with the Scriptures you've posted, will you deal with the ones I keep posting? :smilewinkgrin:

Steve

 

Hello Convicted1,
You quoted two portions of Scripture, 2 Cor 3:5-16 & Gal 3:23-29.

I'd like to start by quoting 2 Cor 3:3. 'Clearly you are an epistle of Christ, ministered by us, written not with ink, but by the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone, but on tablets of flesh, that is, of the heart.'

Matthew Henry wrote, 'The law of Christ was written in their hearts, and the love of Christ shed abroad there. Nor was it written in tables of stone, as the law of God given to Moses, but on the fleshy (not fleshly, as fleshliness denotes sensuality) tables of the heart, Ezek 36:26'—Matthew Henry Concise.

The law, as it came to Israel, was indeed a 'ministry of death.' It commanded, but gave no power to obey. In the New Covenant, the law becomes our friend rather than our enemy. It is written on our hearts (Heb 10:16 etc.), so that we love to live lives that honour our Lord and Saviour, and it grieves us when we fall short. The Old Testament, if we do not find Christ in it, will place a veil upon our hearts because we are looking at orders given that we have no ability to fulfil, but which threaten us with punishment if we fail to obey them. In the New Covenant, we learn that 'There is now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus' (Rom 8:1), but yet we are, 'Not ...without law toward God, but under law toward Christ' (1 Cor 9:21). That is, the law no longer condemns us, but it becomes our delight to observe it and obey it.

Now let's look at the galatians passage:-

'But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.'
Gal 3:23-28 (NKJV)

Let's think about this tutor or schoolmaster. When we were young he set us homework, forced us to learn various facts and stood, cane in hand, to punish us if we fell short or disobeyed. But now that we are finished with school, do we forget everything we learned? Not at all. The facts that were once written on the blackboard for us to learn are now safely stored away in our minds. Though we are no longer under a schoolmaster, we nonetheless respect him and remember what he taught us and try to put it into action.

This is all a bit hurried and disorganized- I have a meeting at my house starting in a few minutes- but I hope you get the point.

Steve

 

The law died to us as believers in Christ, as per Aposotle paul, no longer wedded to that, but now to Christ Himself!

We died to our "marriage" with the Law, now in relationship to Christ!

 

I'm sorry...I haven't read this whole thread...but did you just say "there is no Holy Spirit?"

The Archangel

 

he is saying that when i use the term HS , that I am being unbecoming in a manner worthy to speak of the third person of the Godhead!

 

Antinomianism


From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Antinomianism (a term coined by Martin Luther, from the Greek ἀντί, "against" + νόμος, "law") is defined as holding that, under the gospel dispensation of grace, moral law is of no use or obligation because faith alone is necessary to salvation.[1]

Although the concept is related to the foundational Protestant belief of Sola Fide where justification is through faith alone in Christ, it is taken to an extreme in antinomianism. It is seen by some as the opposite of the notion that obedience to a code of religious law earns salvation: legalism or works righteousness.

While there is wide agreement within Christianity that "antinomianism" is heresy, what constitutes antinomianism is often in disagreement. The term "antinomian" emerged soon after the Protestant Reformation (c.1517) and has historically been used mainly as a pejorative against Christian thinkers or sects who carried their belief in justification by faith further than was customary.[2] For example, Martin Luther preached justification by faith alone but was also an outspoken critic of antinomianism, perhaps most notably in his Against the Antinomians (1539).

While the charge of antinomianism can and often does apply to those who reject the keeping of any codified moral laws, antinomian theology does not necessarily imply the embrace of ethical permissiveness; rather it usually implies emphasis on the inner working of the Holy Spirit as the primary source of ethical guidance.[2]

Although the term originated in early controversies of Protestant doctrine in the 16th century, it has its roots in debates over the Synoptic Gospels and the Pauline Epistles and the issue of Paul of Tarsus and Judaism in the 1st century, and it can be extended to any religious group believing they are not bound to obey the laws of their own religious tradition. However few groups or sects, outside of Christian anarchism or Jewish anarchism, explicitly call themselves "antinomian".


This should not be named among us:type:


In his Introduction to Romans, Luther stated that saving faith is,


a living, creative, active and powerful thing, this faith. Faith cannot help doing good works constantly. It doesn’t stop to ask if good works ought to be done, but before anyone asks, it already has done them and continues to do them without ceasing. Anyone who does not do good works in this manner is an unbeliever...Thus, it is just as impossible to separate faith and works as it is to separate heat and light from fire! [[5]

The Westminster Confession of Faith states:


Faith, thus receiving and resting on Christ and His righteousness, is the alone instrument of justification; yet it is not alone in the person justified, but is ever accompanied with all other saving graces, and is no dead faith, but works by love.[6]

The classic Methodist commentator Adam Clarke held,


The Gospel proclaims liberty from the ceremonial law: but binds you still faster under the moral law. To be freed from the ceremonial law is the Gospel liberty; to pretend freedom from the moral law is Antinomianism.[7]

Likewise on on Titus 1:16 ("They profess that they know God; but in works they deny, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." KJV):


Full of a pretended faith, while utterly destitute of those works by which a genuine faith is accredited and proved.[8]


To which the Presbyterian commentator Mathew Henry concurs: "There are many who in word and tongue profess to know God, and yet in their lives and conversations deny and reject him; their practice is a contradiction to their profession." [9]

Though historically a general consensus has been evident as to which laws of the Old Testament pertain to the category of moral law which Christians are enjoined to keep, (see Biblical law in Christianity) certain laws can somewhat difficult, and may be vulnerable to subjective judgment, (see Cafeteria Christianity), and a broad definition of antinomianism can also be exercised. Christian sects and theologians who feel that they are freed from more laws than is customary are often called "antinomian" by their critics, while those who feel that more than the customary laws apply are in turn called "Judaizers" or legalists by their critics. Theological charges of antinomianism typically imply that the opponent's doctrine leads to various sorts of licentiousness, and imply that the antinomian chooses his theology in order to further a career of dissipation. However, the conspicuous austerity of life among many sects accused of antinomianism (such as Anabaptists or Calvinists) suggests that these accusations are often, or even mostly, made for rhetorical effect. Accusations of antinomianism have also been used more loosely to criticize doctrines that erode the authority of the church, or to criticize teachings perceived as hostile to government and civic law.
Contemporary Evangelical theologian J.I. Packer defines 5 strains of Antinomianism:
Dualistic Antinomianism (Gnostic) This view sees salvation as for the soul only, and bodily behavior as irrelevant both to God’s interest and the soul’s health…
Spirit-centered Antinomianism …puts such trust in the Holy Spirit’s inward prompting as to deny any need to be taught by the law how to live. Freedom from the law as a way of salvation is assumed to bring with it freedom from the law as a guide to conduct.
Christ-centered Antinomianism …argues that God sees no sin in believers, because they are in Christ, who kept the law for them, and therefore what they actually do makes no difference, provided that they keep believing.
Dispensational Antinomianism …denies that biblical law is God’s direct command and affirms that the Bible’s imperative statements trigger the Word of the Spirit, which when it comes may or may not correspond exactly to what is written.
Situationist Antinomianism …says that a motive and intention of love is all that God now requires of Christians, and the commands of the Decalogue and other ethical parts of scripture, for all that they are ascribed to God directly, are mere rules of thumb for loving, rules that love may at times disregard.[10]

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Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
If we are saved we are no longer under the Law but under grace.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
There does seem to be those who would place us back under the Law. Yet as you can see we who are in Christ are not ruled by the Law.
MB

 

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