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History of Baptists back to Christ

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by Acts 1:8, Apr 7, 2003.

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  1. Acts 1:8

    Acts 1:8 New Member

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    Here is a link to an article that traces Baptist History all the back to Christ:

    http://users.aol.com/libcfl/trail.htm

    The entire article is actually more like a short book, but it goes into great detail about the history of the church, the history of the RCC, and the persecution Christians faced at the hand of Rome. Well worth the read. I've enclosed a few quotes.

    -----------------

    Cardinal Hosius (Catholic, 1524), President of the Council of Trent:

    "Were it not that the baptists have been grievously tormented and cut off with the knife during the past twelve hundred years, they would swarm in greater number than all the Reformers." (Hosius, Letters, Apud Opera, pp. 112, 113.)

    The "twelve hundred years" were the years preceding the Reformation in which Rome persecuted Baptists with the most cruel persecution thinkable.

    Sir Isaac Newton:

    "The Baptists are the only body of known Christians that have never symbolized with Rome."

    Mosheim (Lutheran):

    "Before the rise of Luther and Calvin, there lay secreted in almost all the countries of Europe persons who adhered tenaciously to the principles of modern Dutch Baptists."

    Edinburg Cyclopedia (Presbyterian):

    "It must have already occurred to our readers that the Baptists are the same sect of Christians that were formerly described as Ana-Baptists. Indeed this seems to have been their leading principle from the time of Tertullian to the present time."

    Tertullian was born just fifty years after the death of the Apostle John.
     
    #1 Acts 1:8, Apr 7, 2003
  2. Singer

    Singer New Member

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    There is no scriptural evidence that it is important to align
    oneself with the "oldest" group of worshippers in order to become
    a saved child of God.

    My 2x2 upbringing led me to believe that we went all the way back
    to Jesus and that we were sending out workers in pairs and holding
    home meetings in respect to Jesus' commandments. Everyone else
    was worldly.

    Internet Catholics have enlightened me that THEY are the ones
    whose church Jesus established and THEY have the exclusive
    right to administer the gospel.

    An internet Mormon informed me that she belongs to the "One true
    church" and would be glad to notify local LDS members to help usher
    me in to the fold.

    My JW cousins are driven by their desire to see me join them in worship to
    enable my enlistment among the chosen.

    Please don't tell me the Baptists are making this claim also...Please !!

    Aren't the Bereans older than old ?

    Can someone beat this date: AD24-April 14-Tuesday-4:16.23 pm.

    What are we on.......a race for "Who's First" ?

    Would it matter ?

    If it does, then "Whosoever believes in Me" is a crock.

    Can you wonder why I remain unchurched ?
     
    #2 Singer, Apr 7, 2003
  3. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    Born of God... Let me enlighten you... I lost my wife this morning and she was Pentecostal... She believed in Jesus as her Lord and Savior and was surely a child of God!... She is now with him

    I see a lot of Catholics on here that also believe in Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. Now you want to say these who believe even though they are Catholic are not Gods children?

    My wife Charlotte would have only one thing to say to you... You are full of something and it sure is not holy manna... Make of that what you will... I have an outline too... Being the moderator of the Baptist History Forum but I will not post it here... Why would Catholics be interested in a Baptist History outline?

    Enough said if you want you can check them all out in the Baptist History Forum... I don't believe I ever saw you post there?... Don't you know your history?... How about something instructive for a change... Instead of trying to tear everything down... Brother Glen & Sister Charlotte [​IMG]
     
    #3 tyndale1946, Apr 7, 2003
  4. Acts 1:8

    Acts 1:8 New Member

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    Singer, this is by no means a "we were first" type argument. I just posted it for informational and historical purposes. It demonstrates that throughout history there have always been those who held firmly to the truths found in the New Testament, and that we don't owe our christianity to the RCC or any other group or person other than Christ himself.
     
    #4 Acts 1:8, Apr 7, 2003
  5. Acts 1:8

    Acts 1:8 New Member

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    Tyndale1946,

    I'm sorry to hear about your loss. You'd be well advised to read the article before you comment further about who you think I am or what you think I'm trying to convey.

    I like most other people here beleive that there are two types of people. Those who believe and are born of God (John 1:12-13) and those who are not - period.

    Those who have been born of God have the spirit of God to lead them into all truth as promised by the Bible. (John 16:13)

    For those who beleive and follow Catholic doctrine, how can we say they have been lead in the truth by the spirit? If they had the spirit of God would not he have used his sword (the Word Ephesians 6:17) to guide them in the truth?

    You can't deny this- its scriptural.

    As for catholics being truly saved and in heaven once they die, I've never once denied that there are those who have.
     
    #5 Acts 1:8, Apr 7, 2003
  6. Acts 1:8

    Acts 1:8 New Member

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    Alot of people beleive with there minds, but do they beleive with thier hearts?

    James 2:19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that–and shudder.

    Matthew 7:
    22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'
     
    #6 Acts 1:8, Apr 7, 2003
  7. DanielFive

    DanielFive New Member

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    #7 DanielFive, Apr 7, 2003
  8. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    You know Born of God you think you have a lot of good thoughts... And you think you have some good answers... You need to pop down to the Calvin/Arminian Debate Forum which I also moderate and really see how much you do know!

    I challenge you to put this knowledge of scripture and doctrine to practice... Talk to brethren who can go toe to toe with you if you have the muscle :eek: ... I'm leaving the catholics and others alone to worship God according to the dictates of their hearts.

    Put what you say into practice and we will see if it will rise or fall... Lets start with the TULIP doctrine... Any takers?... Brother Glen Moderator of the Calvin/Arminian Debate Forum [​IMG]
     
    #8 tyndale1946, Apr 7, 2003
  9. Acts 1:8

    Acts 1:8 New Member

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    Tyndale,

    I think I'll pass. I'm really not interested in debating Arminian and calvinism. I don't cling wholeheartedly to either of them. I've got the Bible, I can read, and I've got the Holy Spirit. Call me crazy, but I'm satisfied with that.
     
    #9 Acts 1:8, Apr 7, 2003
  10. neal4christ

    neal4christ New Member

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    Bro. Glen,

    I am truly sorry to hear of your loss. I am also truly happy to know that she has gone home to our Lord! My sympathies go out to you, though.

    Neal
     
    #10 neal4christ, Apr 7, 2003
  11. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    I'm really not interested in debating Arminian and calvinism.

    How true. Your posts indicate you wish to only attack Catholicism.
     
    #11 Johnv, Apr 7, 2003
  12. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    OH MY LORD!... Did someone just dethrone the Baptist Pope [​IMG] ... This is not a good day to mess with Brother Glen... I'm a bereaved Primitive Baptist with an attitude... If Jesus Christ didn't save all his people... Out of every kindred... tongue... nation... and people... Then find me a trashcan to toss in my KJV because I don't know squat and neither did my wife Charlotte... I shall now return to my forum and let you Catholics and others argue with the Baptist Dope... I mean Pope :rolleyes: ... Brother Glen & Sister Charlotte [​IMG]
     
    #12 tyndale1946, Apr 7, 2003
  13. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Been there.

    Done that.

    But you are raising my interest in going back again. Is there need for an Arminian rally? I really enjoyed the time I spent there.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
    #13 BobRyan, Apr 7, 2003
  14. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
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    I was more interested in the Baptist Dope.
     
    #14 rsr, Apr 7, 2003
  15. Matt Black

    Matt Black Well-Known Member
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    [​IMG] This old successionist canard again, or is it just another excuse for yet another round of Catholic-baiting? Change the record, people. Oh, and I wouldn't get into bed with Tertullian, if I were you - he ended up a Montanist (kind of a far out extreme charismatic). The same goes for the Cathars and others who were loony gnostics by another name.

    Yours in Christ

    Matt

    Oh, and Brother Glen - my deepest sympathies
     
    #15 Matt Black, Apr 8, 2003
  16. Glen Seeker

    Glen Seeker New Member

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    BoG,

    I just want to say that the history you (or the site you pointed to)believe is true, isn't taught by the Baptist History and Heritage Society.

    Baptist Beginnings
    http://www.baptisthistory.org/facts.htm

    Or by the Baptist Observer. http://www.yellowstone.net/baptist/history.htm

    I'd like to post a paragraph from the last site which refers directly to your point of view.

    God Bless,
     
    #16 Glen Seeker, Apr 8, 2003
  17. Singer

    Singer New Member

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    Chris,

    Good...I'm glad you aren't adhering to the "we were first'' fallacy.
    Right.....we do not owe our christianity to any group. I was raised in
    a group that did just that and I'm not looking to replace it with another
    of like thinking. Like it or not, that is a big push with the RCC.

    Not bashing here...just stating facts.

    All it would take for them to put the subject to rest is to deny that
    their "firstness" has any clout with God. They fail to do that.

    Same with witnessing....can they do it on a "whosoever believes" basis
    and forget the mention of Peter, the term 'catholic', ''church that Jesus
    established'' etc. ? No, they can't. Until that happens, then it's a FACT
    that there is wayyyyyyyy too much emphasis on something other than
    Jesus Christ and Him Crucified.
     
    #17 Singer, Apr 8, 2003
  18. AITB

    AITB <img src="http://www.mildenhall.net/imagemsc/bb128

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    I'm Jewish so I'm firster than any of you Gentile Christians :D

    Helen/AITB
     
    #18 AITB, Apr 8, 2003
  19. Frank

    Frank New Member

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    Tyndale:
    I am sorry for the loss of your wife. I pray the God of comfort be with you in the days ahead.
     
    #19 Frank, Apr 8, 2003
  20. Frank

    Frank New Member

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    Born:
    The new testament church did not begin until 30-33 A.D. According to Isaiah 2:1-4, Micah 4:2, Joel 2:28, Daniel 2:44-47, Mark 9:1, Mat. 2:1-3, Luke 3:1-3, Luke 24:44-51 and Acts 2:1-4,47, the church began at Jerusalem on the Day of Pentecost by the miraculous power of Holy Spirit as the 12 proclamed the gospel of Jesus Christ which is God's only power to save. Romans 1:16, Acts 2:36-47. The church was not established until some 50 days after his crucifixion, resurrection and ascension in Acts 1. Therefore, the history of the church has it's birth after Christ had left the earth.
    The Bible teaches that those of biblical times were called Christians the new name prophesied by Isaiah in 62:2. This name was the one the " mouth of the Lord " proclaimed in Acts 11:26. You can search the new testament and the only " new name " that can be found is CHRISTIAN. Acts 11:26, I Pet. 4:16,Acts 26:28. As for secular history, it may be right; it may be wrong. However, the word of the Lord stands forever. Isaiah 40:8.
     
    #20 Frank, Apr 8, 2003
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