How do you know you are of the elect?

Has "hypercalvinist" ever been defined in history somewhere, or is it just a slur for "Calvinist"?

 

Hello Pipedude.

It's a slur to detract from Calvinism. It is defined as Calvinism by Calvinists.

john.

 

Hypercalvinism is an actual term used for a group who go a bit farther in their interpretation of fundamental Calvinist doctrines. For example, they do not believe the Great Commission was for all men, but for the Apostles alone. They do not believe we should reach out to sinners, but that the elect will come at their appointed time.

They believe differently than us, but they do have a sincere love for Christ and are doing what they believe is right. I know some who hold to this and they are some of the most gentle people you could meet. I believe they have their place in the Kingdom just as I believe Arminians have their place.

The elect are those who came to faith and will come to faith. The elect are His people.

 

Hello dale kesterson nice to meet you.

We all do that in one way or another I don't see why one group should be so named.

I believe in double predestination but many others do not. I think if a person holds the five points that is enough.


john.

 

Tim

I think I covered it in your other thread.

 

Tim

Billwald gave the classic Calvinist arguement(*). You cannot know that you are truly elect.

* I am using the terminology 'Classic Calvinism' -to indicate what Calvin did teach or would have considered in agreement with his teachings. This is to do honor to what he actually wrote.

 

Hello Tim.

By predestination we mean the eternal decree of God, by which he determined with himself whatever he wished to happen with regard to every man. All are not created on equal terms, but some are preordained to eternal life, others to eternal damnation; and, accordingly, as each has been created for one or other of these ends, we say that he has been predestinated to life or to death. (John Calvin Institutes of the Christian Religion Book 3 chapter 21:5.)

If anyone chooses to do God's will, he will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own. John 7:17
I know, I believe. He told me He love me with an everlasting love and I believed Him and recognise myself as elect.

john.

 

It means the lost were predestined for Hell, and not merely that the saved were predestined for Heaven.

Some Calvinists try to affirm the latter without the former. "Although the Bible teaches the predestination of the elect, I do not affirm the predestination of the lost because the Bible doesn't teach that. I leave that up to the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God." Such a one does not believe in double predestination.

To me it always sounded like "I believe that 3+2=5, but I will not affirm that 5-3=2, since the book doesn't expressly say that." But that just goes to show how much Enlightenment humanism has infected this Arminian excuse for a mind.

 

You have ventured a claim and a definition, but now I would like to know where you get this?

In other words, I can imagine the term hypercalvinism being defined subjectively: "anybody who believes or practices more of this idea than I do." As an example, I happen to think that legalism is a word meaning "anybody who thinks that something I do is wrong."

I've certainly heard hypercalvinism used as a slur against plain old garden-variety Calvinists. In such cases it seems to mean "real Calvinist, as distinguished from the Amyraldian chaos that reigns in my mind presently."

But you've described some Hardshells I've heard of. Does the term occur any earlier in history, and are the beliefs of that earlier group identifiable?

 

Particular Baptists come to mind. I am sure not all, but I have met a few who unapologically called themselved hypercalvinists. There is a wing of Primitive Baptists who accept the label (I just met some wonderful PBs, some agree, some don't). Protestant Reformed Church in America is considered to be so, but I have enjoyed their literature and have not found them such.

I found This on Wikipedia.

 

Okay, I'll play your silly game..... If you are a HyperArminian...... How do you know that you are saved? Can you know? Do you trust in a decision you made? Do you trust some other thing you did?

 

Catholics think they are elect. They use different words, same bottom line. For example, everyone in Purgatory is, by definition, "elect."

 

And Catholoics are wrong. The Catholic understanding of election is far differnt that what is biblical.

 

As far off as catholics are with election, calvinists are just as far off. Catholics believe election is corporate but only within the church, calvinism teaches individual election. True election is corporate, but are for those who are "in Christ"

 

Hello Pipedude.

I think that is a good way of looking at it. The bible does not declare a double predestination but logic dictates it. Remember, no one goes to Hell because of sin. I am a sinner and bound for Heaven.

It's a cozy place to be too. I believe that since God is Sovereign then His choice not to choose certain people is a choice. Calvin called it the terrible or horrible decree.


john.

 

Okay, that's what I was looking for.

Maybe we could pass that info around and squelch some of the terminological wobbliness.

Maybe...

 

There can't be a universal call because not everyman hears. The universal call, that is the one that people hear, is do this and live don't do this and die. Is it similar to the law in that the command to believe is there?

Since it is impossible to keep the law but men were commanded to keep I see no reason why men can't be commanded to believe in Jesus, there is a sufficiency in the death of Christ.

People are judged on what they know.

john.

 

For one thing, they believe that if a man was hindu all his life, but elect, he would still be saved.