How many times are we "made alive" in the process of salvation?

Can a noun and a verb be synonymous?

 

A verb is what you do with the noun. God doesn't need to believe in faith that He has given, we do.

 

The absurdity of the belief quickening doesn’t precede regeneration lies in the fact that persons tend to believe they’ve made some ”move of faith,” and were thus rewarded for such move with eternal life.

Believing this, that said person "made a move of faith," or "exercised faith" begins to negate salvation in all its freeness as a gift, making it instead a reward, and shows salvation dependent upon "doing" something. Salvation isn't a reward for faith. Many persons believe the prayer they'd prayed secures salvation. Wrong again. Grace secures it, faith is only proof of one belonging to Him, coupled with good works, since the gift of faith is never alone.

But this is true whether one believes faith a gift or not, for if one in any way believes they've done one simple thing, the gift is then a reward, and was never Biblical salvation nor a gift. The belief is that faith preceded, came before eternal life, was exercised, gaining the reward for such. Instead, God made all the moves, giving faith, quickening and enabling one to believe unto eternal life. It is not a reward, it’s a gift. He does all of the quickening, not just part of it. Lazarus a prime example. He didn’t enable himself, Christ’s Word did it all. The same for all true believers, we did nothing, Christ did it all.

- Peace

 

Proverbs 3:
a. 5 Trust in the LORD with all your heart
and lean not on your own understanding;
6 in all your ways submit to him,
and he will make your paths straight.[ Or will direct your paths ]

Romans 4
4 Now to the one who works, wages are not credited as a gift but as an obligation. 5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness. 6 David says the same thing when he speaks of the blessedness of the one to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:
7 “Blessed are those
whose transgressions are forgiven,
whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the one
whose sin the Lord will never count against them.”

Psalm 73:28
But it is good for me to draw near to God;I have put my trust in the Lord GOD, That I may declare all Your works.

 

Sorry GL, no disrespect, but I don't see the "fly in the ointment" that you seem to see there. I have absolutely NO Disagreement concerning the need of God's grace...NONE.

You (yall) say that this "grace" comes in some form of a special dispensation as a result God's election. I believe this grace is offered to ALL mankind, and I have still heard no argument to suggest that it is not an inherent property of the imago dei. Surely something so theologically profound would have been enunciated clearly to Adam. I don't see that.

 

I'm from up nort' so "ya'll" is still alien to my thinking, and no disrespect taken! We can disagree theologically all day long without disrespecting each other or the doctrines we hold. Doesn't mean that we don't fight like cats and dogs over what we feel is truth, but that doesn't (or should not) go to the man, just the idea!

And, actually, it was given to Adam. God said, "Do this and die." Adam did, and died. Then, in Gen 3, God gave the proto-evangelum -- the promise of a Messiah who would come to set things right -- and it was there that GOD began a new mission in the world to redeem lost sinners.

No "special dispensation" required. in fact, it is Arminianism that has invented the category of "prevenient grace," a "special dispensation" of God's grace if ever there was one.

 

both cals and Arms affirm that man was so ruined by fall, that we MUST have God apply grace to us in order to have us "restored" enough from the fall in order to be actually able to hear the Gospewl and believe in jesus!

Cals affirm that God applies irrestible Grace to His elect, so that they MUST accept Jesus

Arms say God grants coomon grace to all. so that all can freely accept/reject Jesus

Think that unlike MR Skan, you are indeed a Arminianist!

 

See it as actually being BOTH...

God presentined/ordained those whom he would have Grace and mercy be applied to/on, and once they accept Jesus, they fall into the predestined plan of God to have then confirmed into Image of His Son Jesus!

 

Must be in the Lost Gospel of Paul somewhere!

 

I am "no theologian" (I know some hate to hear that phrase), by that I simply mean I do not "professionally" study scripture. I am however, aware of a few things, such as you mention the "proto-evangelion", the announcement of YHWH that HE will be the victor. I do agree with you Adam died, but we differ on the "nuance" of what exactly that death means. Before anyone desires to label me as Pelagian (which I would not shy away from if I was in fact so), Pelagian felt that no work or even "influence" of God was necessary for man to move toward God. One might be able to label me as semi-pelagian as I do believe that salvation in essence is synergistic. I even think most reformers are also synergistic in essence, although I know that most do not feel that way.

 

I "personally" see no problem at all with what you have just expressed. Can I be an Arminian if I believe that one cannot "lose their salvation"? A label does not bother me at all, unless someone is using it in an intentional pejorative manner.

 

Actually think that He meant that in the Future, that God saw not just Isreal as His "chosen peoples" but that BOTH Jews/Gentiles were to come thru Him into one Body, Church...

Referring to all after this, NOT just "remnant" of jews back then!

 

think that an Arm refers to one who holds to what I wrote on Common grace..

I tend NOT to attach lose of salvation, as I think even Arminus himself stated "possibility" did not know for certain!

 

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

But that says nothing about the hardening you mentioned... Just a general sinful nature. I'm looking for you to back up the very special pleading you did concerning the hardening of a person.

 

Now you're turning the meaning a different way than your original how hardening happens.

Hmmmm.