1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured If you could only have ONE Study Bible?

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by Yeshua1, Jan 28, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The Geneva and Kjv both came oftheTynsdale TR tree, correct?
     
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So te 1599 edition was from different editor?
     
  3. McCree79

    McCree79 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Messages:
    2,232
    Likes Received:
    305
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes. The NT was a revision by Tompson. The 1560(Whittingham's 1557 NT) and 1599(Tompson) appear to have been revisions of Tyndale's NT. ....well, Tompson was a revision of a revision.

    Whittingham's worked with other translators and they did their work from the original languages. They didn't just look at Tyndale's work and reword it.

    Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
     
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    They ued same sources as he did, correct?
     
  5. McCree79

    McCree79 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Messages:
    2,232
    Likes Received:
    305
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The TR, yes. It is likely they had access to more than Tyndale, but I would be guessing based upon circumstances of the transaltion work. One group was in exlie, the other guy was running for his life and could only take so much with him.

    Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
     
  6. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    You would be Geneva Bible preferred?
     
  7. McCree79

    McCree79 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Messages:
    2,232
    Likes Received:
    305
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No, not me. I prefer the ESV. I do like the Geneva though.

    Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
     
  8. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Sounds good to me!
     
  9. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    9,796
    Likes Received:
    700
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Those numbers for a single year seem quite inflated. Could you provide the full quote making this claim?
     
  10. GenevanBaptist

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2017
    Messages:
    142
    Likes Received:
    13
    Those two pages are a complete list from the "Historical Catalogue of the British and Foreign Bible Society". Not a quote, but a 'chart' listing each year and which Bible, or NT, with number of editions printed in that year.

    If I can figure it out I will post a photo of the pages.

    If I misunderstood the list I apologize. But I do understand it to mean what I previously posted.
     
  11. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2001
    Messages:
    11,852
    Likes Received:
    1,085
    Faith:
    Baptist
    David Daniell, who has been referenced here, says that (because of the suppression of the Geneva by the English crown and church) there were 140 editions — of varying fidelity to the actual 1599 — were printed (primarily in the Netherlands, whose printers were eager to supply English demand) with the 1599 date even though they were published as late as 1640.

    http://www.tyndale.org/tsj21/daniell.html
     
  12. McCree79

    McCree79 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2015
    Messages:
    2,232
    Likes Received:
    305
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Gary DeMar, President of American Vision &
    Honorary Member of the 1599 Geneva Bible Advisory Board says this in an article

    "While other English translations failed to capture the hearts of the reading public, the Geneva Bible was instantly popular. Between 1560 and 1644 at least 144 editions appeared. For forty years after the publication of the King James Bible, the Geneva Bible continued to be the Bible of the home. Oliver Cromwell used extracts from the Geneva Bible for his Soldier's Pocket Bible which he issued to the army."

    144 is pretty close to the 140 claim made by Daniell.

    Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk
     
  13. GenevanBaptist

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2017
    Messages:
    142
    Likes Received:
    13
    The list they use in Easons book, published 1937, is a list of existing Bibles, whether whole Bible, or just NT, that they are aware of and have record of as actually being possessed by known organizations or persons. Each printing (edition) had a certain amount produced. As such, there weren't only 144 Bibles printed, but possibly 1000's. So to have a couple 100 GB printed in 1599 that weren't Tomson NT's is hardly an impossibility.
     
  14. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    9,796
    Likes Received:
    700
    Faith:
    Baptist
    As I thought.

    Known copies, then, were being counted, not editions, right?
     
  15. Logos1560

    Logos1560 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2004
    Messages:
    6,217
    Likes Received:
    405
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Tomson’s 1576 New Testament should perhaps be considered a different English translation than the 1560 Geneva Bible.

    The title page of a 1599 edition and a 1611 edition of his New Testament stated that it was “translated out of the Greek by Theodore Beza,” which indicated that its basis would have been the Latin New Testament of Beza that Beza himself translated from the Greek. The title page also noted that Beza’s translation was “Englished by L. Tomson.

    Laurence Tomson likely used the 1560 Geneva’s N. T. as a basis for his translating of Beza’s Latin N. T.
    David Daniell referred to “Tomson’s revision of the Geneva English New Testament, based on Beza’s important Latin edition of 1565” (Bible in English, p. 352). Daniell added that “the edition of Beza he [Tomson] is using was that prepared by L’Oiseleur, as he states on his title page, and L‘Oiseleur had put together the notes from Beza and from Joachim Camerarius” (Ibid.).

    Concerning Tomson’s 1576 revision of the Geneva N. T., T. H. Darlow and H. F. Moule noted: “The alterations are mainly due to a comparison with Beza’s Latin version of 1565” (Historical Catalogue, p. 96). In a book published by or for John Rylands Library, this is stated concerning Tomson’s 1576 NT: “The alterations resulted from a close comparison of the Geneva text with Beza’s Latin version of 1565” (Catalogue of an Exhibition of Bibles, p. 24).

    Backus referred to Tomson as the “translator of Beza’s Latin New Testament into English” (Reformed Roots of the English NT, p. 174). Backus noted that “Tomson translated Beza’s Latin New Testament” (pp. 187-188). Backus pointed out that in 1574 Pierre L’Oiselsur de Villers “produced an edition of Beza’s Latin New Testament” and that “in 1576 Tomson published his translation of L’Oiseleur’s edition of Beza’s New Testament” (pp. 18, 22, 27, 188). Backus asserted that “we can see that Beza’s influence on the English Geneva and Laurence Tomson’s version was largely that of his Latin versions” (p. 27). Backus concluded: “We can also see a large measure of agreement between Tomson and Geneva, which suggests that Tomson must, at least, have referred to the 1560 Geneva when translating L’Oiseleur’s edition of Beza’s Latin New Testament” (p. 197).
     
  16. Logos1560

    Logos1560 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2004
    Messages:
    6,217
    Likes Received:
    405
    Faith:
    Baptist
    It seems to be different editions being counted, not known copies.

    Those who listed them found some differences in them indicating that they were different printed editions.
     
  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So there was one version based upon theTR, and aother on the Latin?
     
  18. GenevanBaptist

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2017
    Messages:
    142
    Likes Received:
    13
    Have downloaded a 1557 from Internet Archives - Going to do a little comparison.
    https://archive.org/stream/newtestamentofou42lond#page/n533/mode/2up
     
  19. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    9,796
    Likes Received:
    700
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Please do.

    I have the Historical Catalogue of the British and Foreign Bible Society before me and frankly I don't see how one could get to those numbers from what is presented in the Catalogue.
     
  20. GenevanBaptist

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2017
    Messages:
    142
    Likes Received:
    13
    1557 Wittingham NT -

    "To the which the figure of Baptism is agreeing now that saveth vs also: not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but in that a good conscience maketh request to God, by the resurrection of Jesus Christ, Which is at the right hand of God : gone into heaven, to whom the Angels, powers, and might are subdued."

    1560 Geneva NT -

    "To the which also the figure that now saveth us, even Baptism agreeth (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but in that a good conscience maketh request to God) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ, Which is at the right hand of God, gone into heaven, to whom the Angels, and Powers, and might are subject."

    See a difference?
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...