Indications of the Last Times

The "Last Days" was ushered in at Pentecost and will continue on until the Day! The church won't receive a "sign" of His coming---rather, we'll receive a "Savior"----so quit looking for a sign and start looking for the Savior----any minute now!!

I like what Adrian Rogers says though, "We ought to be living in such a way, it would be as if Christ rose from the dead yesterday, ascended into Glory this morning and is coming back again this afternoon!!"

Brother David

 

Bro David,

I scared how often we agree on stuff

Roger

 

I was recently asked by a coworker how close I think we are to the end times. My reply was "one day closer than yesterday". He didn't appreciate my answer, and told me I need to prepare for it, because it was happenning in his lifetime (he's in his 60's). I reminded him that I was a Christian, so I am prepared.

His next arguement was that I wasn't really prepared, because I was still saving for my retirment. I told him that there's no way he could have reasonable certainty that anything would happen in his lifetime. Jesus said not even he knew. If Jesus didn't know, then how could we know? I reminded him that, to date, everyone that tried to "predict" the end has been wrong.

I then reminded him that we live in southern california. Earthquake preparedness does not mean you're supposed to live in a bunker all your life.

His last retort was a questioning of my beliefs. He said that he never hears me preaching about the second coming. "No," I said, "I'm too busy preaching the first coming". That pretty much shut him up.

 

JohnV,

Indeed the gospel is all wrapped up in the FIRST coming.

Details about the timing of the second coming are mere speculation.

Tim

 

Wow. He's in his 60's... and apparently he must not have saved for his retirement? I suppose he's getting desparate for Jesus to return real SOON!

 

DeafPosttrib: You talk about the signs. Let me ask you question:

Are you looking for the signs?

 

Askjo,

Cannot you see the signs already appearing everywhere according to Matthew chapter 24? Also, can't you see the signs of apostasy increasing everywhere according to 2 Thess. 2:3; 1 Tim. 3:1-7; and 2 Tim. 4:3-4. Christ tells us, of Matt 24:32-33, that we are seeing the signs(doors) show us that His coming draw near, but, we do not know when His coming will be - Matt. 24:40,42. We just be watch and ready all the times no matter what happen to us like car accident, heart attack such like as Sept 11 attack, etc.. we always be ready all times - Rev. 3:2, and be ready for his coming too.

Matt 24:36, 40, 42 do not prove it is 'pretrib' coming such as "immenince coming". These are context with Matt 24:29-31 tell us, His coming will be after the tribulation. We do not know when Christ's coming shall be. The context of Matthew chapter 24 focus only ONE coming of Christ. There is no hint find anywhere in Matthew chapter 24 telling us there are two comings. Christ never give us the hint of two comings. He spoken of HIS coming at the end of the world, He answered according his disciples' question (Matt 24:3).

Right now, we already seeing the signs appearing everywhere since Early Church to now. But, we do not know when His coming shall be, we always be watch and be ready for His coming all the times.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 - Amen!

 

Askjo,

Of course, I am eager LOOKING FORWARD for Christ's coming!!! - Titus 2:13. When? Don't know. Be watch and ready all the time!

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 - Amen!

 

DPT: "Cannot you see the signs already appearing everywhere
according to Matthew chapter 24?"

Actually Matthew 24:4-14 is the signs that we are
in the last days, time of the gentiles, church age.
Then there are the signs of the coming Tribulation Period,
and signs of the coming physical Millinnial Kingdom of Christ.
But i need to go to bed now so i can go to work
in the morning. May lots of good blessings
from God be unto my feller discussers this evening,
their families, and their ministries. Amens.

 

Ed,

I agree. Yes, Matt 24:1-14 is the signs that we are in the last days right now. But, the signs cannot separate from Matt 24:15-22, 27-31. These signs always include them, Matt 24:34 tells us, the last generation shall not be passed till [/B]ALL these things[/B] be fulfilled, that means the final generation shall see the signs of Matt 24:1-14, include shall see the great persecutions of verse 15-22, also, they shall see the signs of His coming - Matt 24:27-31.

Therefore, the final generation of the Christians who shall see the signs include cosmic disturbance, ALL of these signs must be fulfilled by Lord's coming.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 - Amen!

 

But Ed, you said the last days started at Pentecost and continue on. So everyone for the last 2000 years have been in the last days according to your view.

 

But Ed, you said the last days started at Pentecost and continue on. So everyone for the last 2000 years have been in the last days according to your view. </font>[/QUOTE]God bless you, Brother Grashopper
You seem to be the first one here
to acknowledge you understand
what the Bible says on this matter.
Jesus said it,
I believe it,
and that settles it!

(BTW, Jesus would settle it whether or not
i believe it).

 

I agree with Ed on his biblical assessment. Now, no one has a remote clue as to how far into the last day we are: 50%, 90%, or 5%. Anyone who claims to know is, well, probably just upset that they didn't save for their retirement.

 

The poor man. If Jesus doesn't return by the time he is supposed to retire, then I guess he won't retire. He will have financially gambled and lost every bit as much as if he had gone to Las Vegas and lost at the blackjack table.

I guess the taxpayers will end up having to support the man.

 

You completely ignored your contradition. You say on one hand, that Matt 24 proves we are in the last days, but on the other hand you say everyone since pentecost and everyone in our future is in the last days.

Is it your position that Matt. 24 is a sign for every generation?

 

Ed: "Actually Matthew 24:4-14 is the signs that we are
in the last days,"

Grasshopper: "Is it your position that Matt. 24
is a sign for every generation?"

1. That is Matthew 24:4-14.

2. Yes and no.
The signs of Matthew 24:4-14 are the signs we are in
the last days. As long as those signs are there,
we can show we are in the last days. But let
"peace" suddenly break out and we will find ourselves
in Antichrist world.
So Matthew 24:4-14 mentions signs that are applicable
to all generations 33 AD to 2004 AD
and other generations that might come, should the
Lord tary.
Matthew 24:4-14 will NOT be applicable to the
generations in the physical
Millinnial Kingdom of Christ on this physcial world.

Grasshopper: "You completely ignored your contradition"

I cannot ignore the contradiciton i didn't make.
All contradictions are in your mind.

Grasshopper: "So everyone for the last 2000 years have
been in the last days according to your view."

1,971 to be exact.
BTW the only part i didn't get out of the bible was
that the start was in 33AD (history)
and the currenct date is 2004AD (science).
Peter said that on the day of Pentacost (i believe it
to be 33AD, others give other dates) that the "last days"
were there.
The Bible teaches that this age will
end (any problems with that?)
This age started per Peter in 33 AD (any problems with that?)

What contradicion? Is it your contention that the Bible
contradicts itself?

Ed's understanding of Matthew 24:
--------------
In Matthew 24:3 the disciples of Jesus
ask three questions:

(in the order asked):
1. When will the Temple be destroyed?
2. What is the sign of His coming?
3. What is the sign of the end of age?

Jesus answers these questions in
Matthew 24:4-44, then follows them with
some parables.

Here are the answers of Jesus in the
order the questions were asked:

1. When will the Temple be destroyed?
Matthew 24:4-14

2. What is the sign of His coming?
Matthew 24:15-30

3. What is the sign of the end of age?
Matthew 24:31-44

Here is a summary of the answers
in the order in which events will occur:

1. When will the Temple be destroyed?
Soon, it was in 70AD

3. What is the sign of the end of age?
No signs preceeding the end of the age

2. What is the sign of His coming?
The Sign of His coming will be the
Tribulation period.

Recall the Greek language in which this
Mount Olivet Discourse (MOD) was written
did not have Microsoft Word to do it with.
So many ands, buts, and other connectors
give the outline. I believe the major
outline to be:

1. When will the Temple be destroyed?
Matthew 24:4-14

2. What is the sign of His coming?
Matthew 24:15-30

3. What is the sign of the end of age?
Matthew 24:31-44

The Gathering in Matthew 24:31 is the
Rapture/resurrection which ends the
current church age (gentile age, age of grace,
last days, etc&gt

Thus Matthew 24:4-14 describes all of the
church age even up to this time.
Matthew 24:4-14 describes the church age.

 

Your position likes to have it both ways.

So we should encourage war and strife.

The age that would end was the Jewish/Old Covenant age in which they lived. When does the Church age end?

Eph 3:21 unto him be the glory in the church and in Christ Jesus unto all generations for ever and ever. Amen.

I would say in 29 or 30.

The bible gave signs of when these things would happen. You claim because we see these signs, that proves we are in the last days. But you also believe that everyone since the 1st century has lived in the last days. Therefore the signs are meaningless, because whether they are there or not, you believe we are in the last days.

All the events were to happen within the same generation. Read Mark and Luke's account of the Olivet Discourse to get the fulll picture.

Mark 13:4 Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when these things are all about to be accomplished?

Luke 21:7 And they asked him, saying, Teacher, when therefore shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when these things are about to come to pass?

Questions:
1. When
2. What are the signs.

They are not to be separated over centuries.

 

Mark 13:4 Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when these things are all about to be accomplished?

Luke 21:7 And they asked him, saying, Teacher, when therefore shall these things be? and what shall be the sign when these things are about to come to pass?

I note that when the disciples asked the
questions they had not read Paul's writings
nor John's on eschatology.

Grasshopper: "But you also believe that everyone since the 1st century has lived in the last days."

Again, your wording confuses me.
I didn't make this doctrine out of
whole cloth and try to find it in the
Bible, i found the doctrine in the Bible.

When does the last days end?
I believe it to be at the pretribulation
rapture. The pretribulation rapture
begins the last day (a 7 year long "day").

 

Diane:
On the housetop, waiting for the trumpet sound!

The trumpet sound is also the time when the dead in Christ are raised out of their graves (1 Thess. 4:16).


Is the rapture the time when the dead shall come up out of their graves? Because this rising of the dead happens at the last trumpet sound (1 Cor. 15: 52).

".....for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed" (1 Cor. 15:52).

So is Diane going to be raptured the same moment the dead rise from their graves? Is that how it works ?

[ May 09, 2004, 11:23 PM: Message edited by: wopik ]

 

You betcha!

Still looking for the word "last"
in ".....for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed" (1 Cor. 15:52).

Still looking for the word "last"
in ".....for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed" (1 Cor. 15:52).