Indications of the Last Times

Ed,

I need to go now. I will reply back it to you later today.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 - Amen!

 

You know what? It's all conjecture. The Scriptures are transparent in some places and very deep in others. Many times throughout history believers have thought that the end was near. They were proved wrong. We have reasons now to believe that the time has come that make sense to some, but we could be wrong too.

This is a healthy thing, to be digging into the Scripture to see if the signs it gives are here. The important thing is to remember that it is conjecture, and treat our theories as such.

I personally hold the prevailing pretrib view. But if God's plan plays out to show that I am wrong, and I find myself in the "Great Tribulation," then I trust God to give the grace to do whatever He has planned for me to do.

So let's stop arguing, and treat this subject simply as a scholarly pursuit, knowing the real answer lies with God - the only one who knows the day and the hour.

Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

 

Brother Ed,

Wopik is not one who takes rebuttal of his position very well:

What Happens When We Die

 

Don't worry,
i only post while wearing the full
armor of God. Ephesians 6:14-18

And besides, i've got a four barrelled
canon (cannon?)!

TODAY'S PARALLEL BIBLE
(KJV) King James Version, 1873 edition
NASB - New American Standard Bible
NIV - New International Version
NLT - New Living Translation

 

Ed; Although I am also pre-trib, DPT has DEMOLISHED your three main passages for pre-trib. I read all five pages of this thread out of curiosity, not intending to get into it. DPT gave the exact exposition of your scriptures that I would have. I was thinking about this expostion as I checked the Scriptures you gave. There is NO support for pre-trib in those verses. Methinks you are a great 'isogesist'(sp) but not very good at 'exegesis'. Also I think you need to pick another three vrs or re-load that canon of yerz.
Now don't do you usual evasive tactics, just answer the charges. Where is pre-trib in THOSE passages? Remember, context and literal. If the passage NATURALLY prevents literal interpretation then you're free to spiritualize or whatever, but if not, then NOT!
Jim

 

av1611jim: "Now don't do you usual evasive tactics, just answer the charges."

No.
That is my answer.
Is that your final answer?
Yes, "no" is my final answer.
Sorry, int his debate the plaing field is level.
If you answer only the high level premesis
and not the details; i'll answer only the high level
points and not the detail points.

BTW, did you happen to notice that Brother DPT is
a-mill? Is he also required to defend his stance
there in a-mill?

--Ed, providing rock solid arguin' based on nother
other foundation than the Solid Rock: our blessed
Lord and Savior: Messiah Yeshua. Amen.

- baptist Graemlin, no pentacostal
jumpin' up in the air

 

They can't be same. Who requires the signs?

 

Askjo,

Pretrib often cited 1 Cor. 1:22 to prove that the signs are the Jews only.

Remember the hermenutic rule - intepreting in CONTEXTUALLY.

The only way we can understand verse 22 start context with verse 17 to 25. Apostle Paul talking about GOSPEL. Paul tells us, that God gaves us the wisdom for to PREACHING the gospel.

The purpose of preaching the gospel, God gives His power and wisdom to us to preaching to SAVED people.

Do not limited a verse - v. 22 only. Yes, it is true that Jews REQUIRE the signs, but, Gentiles seek after wisdom. Paul's point is, Jews' way, they WANT sign, then shall beleive on it. Jews have lack of their faith. Greeks' way, they were pride filled with philosphy. Famous Greek philospher named Aristole. Sad, He said on deaf people, deaf people are ANIMAL!!! Lot of Greek people were pride filled with their own philosphy. Paul's point of verse 22, it shows of two classes what they demand. Jews WANTED the sign, sooooo they will believe it in their own sight. They were lack of their faith. Greeks always seek after their own philosophy. Greeks were filled of pride, philosphy and educated.

Look next verse 23 says, "BUT we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a STUMBLING BLOCK, and unto the Greeks FOOLISHNESS."

Understand, Jews' habit, they demand seek after the sign, so, they will believe it. But they were lack of their faith, and also, they were so very blind. That why, Paul called Jews, "a stumbling block" shows that they were act like donkey's eye was limited can't see both opposite sides, easy to fall down. Paul called Greek, "foolishness". He made a point on Greeks, Greeks were filled with their pride, philosphy and educated, their philosphy and educated are WORTHLESS!

Paul said of verse 25, "BUT unto them(both Jews and Gentiles)WHICH ARE CALLED, both Jews and Greeks, Chrust the POWER of God and the WISDOM of God."

It tells us, God called us in his purpose of his power and wisdom, that we are commanded to PREACH the gospel to people.

Verse 25 tells us, the gospel is foolishness of God BUT wiser than sinner. The gospel is weakness of God BUT stronger(power) than sinner.

The context of 1 Cor. 1:17-25(you can read all through till verse 31, if you want to) talk about the POWER of preaching the gospel to the world.

1 Cor. 1:22 do nothing with Matthew chapter 24. The signs are for the Jews ONLY is not what in Paul's mind. He talking about the difference between Jews and Greeks, what both in their own demands. The context of 1 Cor. 1:17-25 discuss about the power of the preaching of the gospel to the world that God called us and give His wisdom and power to us, so, we can preach the gospel to the world to become saved.

1 Cor. 1:22 do nothing with Matthew chapter 24.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 - Amen!