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Featured Legalism

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Salty, Feb 20, 2019.

  1. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    I found this statement on a web page:


    11. A Lack of Eternal Security Leads to Legalism
    Legalism is the conviction that you must do something to earn your eternal life, keep your eternal life, or prove you have eternal life. Legalism is revealed whenever there are a set of rules or regulations or law that a person must maintain in order to get eternal life, keep eternal life, or prove that they have eternal life.

    Link for this

    Would you agree agree that statement above?
     
  2. Pastor_Bob

    Pastor_Bob Well-Known Member

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    I would disagree with the assertion that it is legalism to present fruit for one's salvation. The Bible is full of principles which state that a Christian should, indeed, evidence their salvation by works. Acts 15 speaks of justification before God, how we are forgiven of our sins and receive eternal life without works. James 2 speaks of justification before men, or how one shows that he is saved by the evidence of his life (works).
     
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  3. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    That's a really bad link. He keeps mentioning Romans 6:1 without ever touching on Romans 6:2. He never mentions repentance (unless I missed it) which appears pretty much as often as believing in Christ. Also, he does not discuss what it means to believe on Christ. It is something more than believing that He existed and did some good stuff a long time ago.
    We don't have to 'prove' that we have eternal life, but 1 Corinthians 6:9 and Galatians 5:21 both warn us that people who continue to sin egregiously without repentance will not inherit the kingdom of God, whether or not they think they have believed on Christ.

    John 10::27-28 tells us that Christ's sheep will never perish; but it also tells us that Christ's sheep are a special breed. They are distinguished by their ears and their feet. They hear the Shepherd's voice, and they follow Him. If you are someone who does not listen to Christ's words as you find them in the Bible, and you do not follow His commands (c.f. John 14:15), why would you think you were one of Christ's sheep?
     
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  4. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    (just wanted to say - when I posted this - I has having trouble with my mouse -l I barely got the info posted I
     
  5. questdriven

    questdriven Well-Known Member

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    I agree, ish. I consider legalism to mean a bunch of overly restrictive, barely-if-at-all Biblical rules that are adhered to the point that other churches who do not adhere to those rules are considered apostate.
     
  6. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    I believe legalism is to act outside the boundaries of faith in an attempt to please God - Two source principles, 2 action principles:

    Ephesians 2
    8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
    9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
    10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

    Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him (God): for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

    Romans 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

    James 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

     
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  7. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    Legalism is broader than applying just to salvation. Legalism is the belief that works or piety make one righteous. There are Christians who fall into legalism; believing their piety somehow makes them more spiritual.
     
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  8. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Actually James is arguing that Abraham was also justified before God by his work, Genesis 22:12, ". . . now I know . . . ." This does not negate Abraham having been fully justified without that work, Genesis 15:6; Romans 4:5.
     
  9. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Abraham's works proved he had faith.
     
  10. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Not merely faith, but faith in the LORD God.

    Everyone has some kind of faith by reason of the God given natural revelation, Romans 10:17-18, Psalms 19:1-4.
     
  11. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    If its not "faith in the LORD God" its not faith.
     
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  12. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Nonsense. Everyone has some kind faith. Yes, Abraham's work some many years later proved he had faith in the LORD God. According to Josephus Isaac was 25 years of age [Antiquities of the Jews 1:13.2].
     
  13. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    REPEAT - If its not "faith in the LORD God" its not faith.
     
  14. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Ok, you are wrong then. The Faith (noun) and faith in (verb) are two different parts of speech. Everyone has faith in something.
     
  15. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    There is no faith other than biblical faith in God.

    But, you may have your "faith", I prefer mine :)

    I'll perhaps admit to your point if you will perhaps admit to mine.:)
     
  16. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    An unBiblical atheistic view of faith. No one knows anything without faith in it.
     
  17. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Hi Salty, Christ died between two thieves. His gospel also hangs between two thieves, Lawlessness and Legalism.

    Ever wonder why we are instructed to teach disciples all that Christ commanded? So they would ignore "be kind to one another" or ignore making disciples?

    1) What must we do to be saved? Believe on he Lord Jesus Christ. Is that Legalism or the gospel?
    2) Once saved, can we lose our salvation? No! Is that Lawlessness or the gospel?
    3) Are we to examine ourselves at communion to see if we are of the faith? Yes Is that Legalism or the gospel?
     
  18. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    ". . . the faith which was once delivered unto the saints. . . ." -- Jude 1:3. πιστει noun, "for the faith."

    One of my dictionaries gives a 4th usage of this noun "faith" as "anything believed." I have had this dictionary for some 50 years.

    Knowledge, any kind of knowledge is contingent on faith in it.
     
    #18 37818, Mar 1, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2019
  19. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Yes, a dictionary written by a man probably in his grave or soon to be.

    You also have book written by God defining faith.

    I know you understand my point because you defined it in your scripture quote from Jude above.

    It certainly was not the "faith" in/of/about/ or based upon Buddha which was delivered unto the saints.

    All other "faith" apart from the faith derived from God's book is at best a counterfeit.
     
  20. Danthemailman

    Danthemailman Active Member

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    Speaking of legalism, on a different Christian forum, I was reading a post in which someone accused another member of teaching a "works based" false gospel and that member in an attempt to defend themselves, made this statement below:

    I push a "works plus grace gospel" to maintain my salvation. That member also stated: Salvation is not a gift, but a prize we get at the end and we cannot claim it until we have earned it.

    Earning salvation is certainly legalism.
    Salvation either obtained and/or maintained by works is legalism. That same member lacks eternal security and constantly attacks those in the OSAS camp.
     
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