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Featured lies, evil and chaos.

Discussion in 'Fundamental Baptist Forum' started by 37818, Jul 10, 2019.

  1. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    That's the prob with relying on the KJV - it has many words that had different meanings 400 years ago from what they do now. Unless one is thoroughly familiar with Elizabethan English, one can be misled.
     
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  2. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, in that those cows were not good cows. The fact that "well" good looking cows can be made to look bad and be not good cows illustrates the Hebrew word for "evil" is the meaning of harm of some good. In this case "well" favored cows can be not good, as the Hebrew word for "evil" in case is translated "ill" cows.
     
  3. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    The Hebrew word for "evil" has the meaing of what is contrary to what would be a "good," Evil is defined by the hurt of some kind of good. The point of argument here, is the "problem of evil" is really the problem of some kind of good being harmed in some way.
     
  4. Wesley Briggman

    Wesley Briggman Active Member
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    I believe your contrast should be between God and Lucifer.

    Jhn 8:44 KJV - Ye are of [your] father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

    1Ti 4:1 KJV - Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
    1Ti 4:2 KJV - Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
    1Ti 4:3 KJV - Forbidding to marry, [and commanding] to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
     
  5. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Ok. You seem to be failing to understand the fundamentals in being, Truth, Good and Order. The so called problem of evil, is really a problem of finite good being harmed in some way. God is the fundamental basis of all truth, good and order.

    The fallen angle who from the Latin for the Hebrew is being called Lucifer. He is a created being. And all created things are finiie and temporal entities. And only God is infinite good and cannot lie, be evil and is the fundamental basis of all that exists. All the other unfallen angels abide in God's infinite goodness - so are kept sinless. And God in the New Heaven and Earth will then keep all things holy by the power of His infinite goodness. The eternal fire was created for those that will not abide in God. And for eternity all that are lost will be kept only in God's, the Lamb and His holy angels presence (Revelation 14:10; Matthew 25:41).
     
  6. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    I believe God is sovereign over His creation, therefore He either causes or allows whatsoever comes to pass. Using this definition, without God allowing evil, evil would not exist, thus God becomes the indirect cause of evil.

    And secondly, if something is adverse to us, we may call it evil, like thinking of a tornado that destroys our house as an "evil" wind. God created our sometimes harsh environment, and those affected may see it as evil.
     
  7. delizzle

    delizzle Active Member

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    Here is an excerpt from a paper I wrote about the topic while in seminary.

    "If God is omnibenevolent, evil cannot be within Him, nor can it be emanated or created by Him. As the supremely sovereign creator, what then is "evil"? The skeptic will argue that if God is the creator of everything in existence and all things were created through Him (Gen. 1:1; John 1:3; Col. 1:16; Rev. 4:11) and evil is something that exists, God must have created evil too. After all, it is written, “…I am the LORD, and there is no other. I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the LORD, do all these things” (Isa. 45:6-7). It seems as though that scripture confirms the skeptic’s claim. Furthermore, denying either God or evil leads to dualism or pantheism.

    Thomas Aquinas responds the Summa Theologica, on question XLVIII. Aquinas proposes that "evil" is not a substance but absence or corruption of substance. More specifically, Aquinas states that "evil is signified as the absence of good." It is not enough to say that evil is merely an "absence." Instead, it is a privation or absence of something that should be present. This definition by no means implies that evil does not exist, or we fall into a pantheistic conclusion. Rather, as Norman Geisler explains, "Evil is a real lack, privation, or corruption of a good thing. That is, evil does not exist in itself: evil exists only in a thing or substance – and all things God made are good" (Geisler 2011, 18). Therefore, God is the creator of everything in existence. However, since evil is not a thing but a privation of good, God did not create evil. Instead, good must exist to make evil possible.

    Furthermore, by comparing evil to moth holes, Geisler concludes that nothing can be entirely evil. Moth holes can corrupt a sweater, but a wholly moth-eater garment is just a hangar in the closet (Geisler 2011, 19). Satan, who by his nature, is utterly evil in a moral sense (John 8:44) is still good in a metaphysical sense because Lucifer was an angel of God. Morally, it is possible for a mere human to be utterly depraved, yet metaphysically still be good in that they are still image bearers of God."
     
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  8. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Man has little to fear of what men do in the name of evil, but God help us from what men do in the name of good.

    Some of our beliefs are true, some of our beliefs miss the mark. Our lives are a search for truth, and a life well lived worships Truth. Truth is what has fidelity to the original, Jesus provided the perfect image of God, thus He is Truth.
     
  9. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    "All good" is not the same things as "infinite good." All good excludes evil in any way. Where as infinite good cannot be affected by evil. Infinite good cannot be caused to be evil. The fact that there is evil rules out an all good God. But does not rule out that God is infinite good and evil does exist. God is the uncaused existence, infinite and omnipresent in which anything that exists must exist "in."

    And the infinite good God is better than any kind of all good God [which does not exist].

    Evil needs good that can be hurt to exist. Only God is infinite good which cannot be hurt. All created good is finite. Only finite good can be hurt by evil. Infinite good is not the created good.
     
    #29 37818, Jul 15, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2019
  10. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    33But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.

    34“Therefore do not be anxious about tomorrow, for tomorrow will be anxious for itself. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble. (Evil)
     
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  11. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    Evil or sin is disobeying God, simple as that. While He now allows it to happen, He will punish it if not forgiven by Jesus. That's as succintly as I can put it.
     
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  12. Just_Ahead

    Just_Ahead Member

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    Desire for chaos increases each day. What would the history of global order and chaos reveal?
     
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