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Featured Matthew 28:1-10 versus John 20:1and 2.

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by rstrats, Jun 5, 2019.

  1. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Ok, state what this problem is. Present the problem.
     
  2. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    I thought I did that in post #16? All you need to do is read the four passages that describe the event, Matthew 28:1-8, Mark 16:1-8, Luke 24:1-10 and John 20:1-8.

    Let me do a little of your study, in Matthew Jesus meets with "women" on the way to tell the disciples, and Mary Magdalene may be among them, but Matthew does not say.

    And, of course Mark 16:9 specifically says Jesus first met with Mary Magdalene.

    Luke does not record the meeting with the "women" on the way.

    John does not record the meeting with the "women" on the way.

    So in Mark, Mary Magdalene knows Jesus has risen, but in John Mary Magdalene does not know where "they have laid Him."

    My solution, Mary Magdalene was either ahead or behind the "women" who met Jesus, and therefore did not know where He was laid when she met Peter. The Mark account is flawed.
     
  3. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    None of that is necessary. John records that Mary went to the tomb twice
     
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  4. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Please provide the verse?
     
  5. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Please provide the verse?
     
  6. GoodTidings

    GoodTidings Well-Known Member

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    What it means is that the writers of the Gospels did not conspire to tell a fictitious story. It lends credibility to the truth of the story.

    In law enforcement, when you have multiple witnesses to the same event, they expect a range of divergence in the details of the events. They expect the that the witnesses will tell different stories because they witnessed it from different angles.

    The writers of the Gospels are speaking to the same core event, the resurrection of Jesus from different vantage point and so we should expect a divergence with regard to the secondary details. Those secondary details can be different for a variety of reasons while still preserving the integrity of the core event. If all of the writers had the same exact details, said the same exact things, it would actually detract from the truthfulness of the accounts they give.
     
  7. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    We are not told who those "women" are in Matthew 28:9. Nothing there to rule out Jesus having met Mary M prior.
     
  8. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    If she met Jesus on the way, why did she not know "where they laid Him?"
     
  9. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    John 20:1-2 Mary goes to the tomb, finds it empty and runs to the disciples to give them the news. She runs back to the tomb with the disciples. The disciples leave and Mary stays, verse 11. Afterward, she has her encounter with Jesus.

    Peace to you
     
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  10. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    It was before the 2nd visit to the tomb.

    Peace to you
     
  11. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    If your view makes sense to you, fine.

    But Luke has the women reporting that Jesus is risen to the Eleven, and then Peter ran to the tomb. And even if Mary Magdalene was ahead of the group and did not know Jesus was risen, the other women did, making them the first to meet Jesus, and making Mark 16:9 wrong. To claim Peter started running to the tomb before the women who had met Jesus got there is to make Luke wrong. Not a solution.

    Or that is how it seems to me.
     
  12. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    Again, I believe you are looking at the text with modern historian expectations. The writers of scripture all had specific information they wanted to emphasize. They weren't attempting to put things in chronological order. They weren't attempting to reveal all the known facts of this event in a step by step order.

    It is a mistake to attempt to apply modern historian expectations on these ancient documents.

    Peace to you
     
  13. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    I provided a solution to a difficulty. It may not be the correct solution, but it harmonizes Matthew, Luke and John, but throws the long ending to Mark under the bus. The key interpretation is to say Mary Magdalene was not with the group of women when they met Jesus (maybe she had run ahead a bit), but was with them at the tomb and when they reported to the Eleven.
     
  14. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Oops!

    In post #22 I said, " Luke does not record the meeting with the "women" on the way." But I failed to address why Mary Magdalene said she did not "know where they laid Him." when the women were told, verse Luke 24:6 "He is risen." My solution is to say the women who entered the tomb initially were told, but Mary Magdalene must have remained outside when the message was delivered, that is why she had a different story from some of the other women. So, according to my solution, she did not get the message in the tomb and she did not meet Jesus on the way to the disciples.
     
  15. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    Ok. That makes sense. Personally, I think it possible, even likely, the tomb was visited by many people at various times during the morning and some more than once and the writers used the various accounts in their gospels.

    Peace to you
     
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  16. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yes, accounts of the same events can differ because everything is not observed and reported by everyone. And more than one way can be found to harmonize differing accounts.
     
  17. rstrats

    rstrats Member
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    canadyjd,
    re: "...I think it possible, even likely, the tomb was visited by many people at various times..."


    Why do you suppose Peter went back to the tomb a second time?
     
  18. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    I said, according to scripture, Mary made 2 trips to the tomb. I don't know if Peter went twice, but if someone in your circle claimed to have seen Jesus in the area, I wouldnt be surprised if he made another trip not recorded in scripture.
     
  19. rstrats

    rstrats Member
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    canadyjd,
    re: " I don't know if Peter went twice, but if someone in your circle claimed to have seen Jesus in the area, I wouldnt be surprised if he made another trip not recorded in scripture."

    But it is recorded in scripture if the John account is talking about a first visit to the tomb and the Luke account is talking about a second visit to the tomb.
     
  20. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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