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My Former Pastor's Doctrine Deeply Concerns Me, What Do I Do?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Steven Yeadon, May 23, 2018.

  1. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Well-Known Member
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    My former pastor said some things to me in a theological discussion recently that deeply and profoundly concern me.

    The discussion we were having turned to the topic of confirming salvation with works from a heartfelt faith. He opposed the idea, stating that most Christians regularly sin in shocking ways condemned by the bible such as drug abuse and alcoholism. These people need not confirm their faith through obedience to Jesus. They are safe by believing in Jesus, even if they boldly sin and make it a practice. To press this point home he said prostitutes were found in MLK's hotel room when he was murdered. This doesn't in anyway cause us to question his salvation.

    I am in shock by this stance. It seems a first order theological concern to teach what, to me, is an alien understanding of salvation and personal holiness. Topics that seem primary concerns in the bible.

    I mean, salvation that does not change you as a lost sinner shows the faith you have was never substantive. I could quote tons of bible verses on this truth. The MLK reference also floors me.

    I now question previous sermon messages entirely. I easily see how this viewpoint is enmeshed in my former pastor's messages.

    I feel the need to correct my old pastor, which feels shocking and daunting. I know with certainty that I would not feel comfortable sitting for one of his sermons knowing his doctrine on the effects of faith.

    What should I do?
     
  2. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    You should take it up with him.

    Step #1. Mat 18:15 And if thy brother sin against thee, go, show him his fault between thee and him alone: if he hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

    Step #2. Mat 18:16 But if he hear thee not, take with thee one or two more, that at the mouth of two witnesses or three every word may be established.

    Step #3. Mat 18:17 And if he refuse to hear them, tell it unto the church: and if he refuse to hear the church also, let him be unto thee as the Gentile and the publican.

    Steven, in another thread you indicated a desire to write a book on theology, but it seems you me you may be lacking in the very basics. The bible is pretty clear on how to deal with such conflicts.

    You go to him and discuss it. If he refuses you go again with witnesses. If he refuses again you take it before the church.
     
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  3. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Well-Known Member
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    Thank you for the advice Tom. I know those verses well, but I doubted if they applied to a pastor. I will have to schedule an uncomfortable sit down, and think through my next actions.

    I do agree on not writing the book at this point, I am still discovering so much in the Word as I do an inductive study of the NT and Book of Proverbs. I will continue to outline my essays, as I find that develops my own doctrine. When my inductive Bible study is done in a year or two, I will then worry about finishing my book and publishing it.
     
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The Pastor seems to be hold to a very extreme vie wof OSAS, as he has forgotten that those who claim to know Jesus are to be shown evidence of having a changed life by Him now! Not perfect, but able to shown a definite change, and a bent to obeying the Lord now!
     
  5. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    (in addition to TCassidy)

    Actually a local church not your own should not be your problem.But it seems you have let it impact you.
    The Spirit of God should be providing reproof if you have been entangled in iniquity.

    Come out from among them and be ye separate...

    Now,take the "babes" of 1 Corinthians, they were walking contrary to holiness, also the 7 churches of the Revelation were not models (for the most part) of Jesus Christ's image.

    So "shocking" sin can and does happen in Bible believing local churches, BUT there is consequence... There was physical death, sickness, weakness and chastisement from the Father for those who were His children in these churches.

    2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.


    If they don't acknowledge the truth then leave the phonies (probable) alone...

    RE the tares (the phonies)

    Matthew 13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

    Separate from them, God will deal with them in His own time (but pray for them, and if opportunity arises counsel them).

    2 Timothy 2
    24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
    25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
    26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.
     
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  6. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    For added clarification - you mentioned "former pastor" Is that because he left the church - if so, is he now the pastor of another church
    OR
    is it because you moved your membership to another local church?
     
  7. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Well-Known Member
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    I moved to another church to find small groups with more people my age. I am specifically looking for someone to court or date. If I find no one I'll probably go to another church than my current one in several months. I have also thought of using online dating.

    I did have theological differences on the role of women in church leadership that led to my old pastor telling me it may be best to find another fellowship. I was surprised by that, but in practice, I can't serve in a variety of ministries now headed by women.

    That said, my old pastor has discipled me for years, and he is a mentor.
     
  8. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Scriptures teach to us that females can do many things in the Church, but not be either a pastor or an Elder.
    I would seek out a church that taught that the scriptures are fully inspired and infallible, taught the true Gospel, and was into discipleship and witnessing!
     
  9. Steven Yeadon

    Steven Yeadon Well-Known Member
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    My stance on the bible is that women cannot lead ministries where they will direct and hold authority over men. They can manage and lead children and other women, but not men. My stance was understood by the church along with my stance it would go against my conscience to serve in ministries under a woman.
     
  10. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    You would be heeding the scriptures themselves on this issue!
     
  11. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Make sure you correctly understand him.
     
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  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Sounds like a strong "free grace" Pastor....
     
  13. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Yep, possibly a case of greasy grace.
     
  14. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Even those who would not hold to a Reformed salvation model would really question teaching that we can be saved, and yet still keep on living like nothing happened!
     
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  15. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    If we were "saved" and kept on living as if nothing happened the probably nothing did happened.
     
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  16. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    There is this thing called backsliding. I was saved at age 7. I lived my life on fire for Christ until 17. From 17 to 18 1/2, I became lukewarm. By 19 I was full blown backslidden. I was saved. The Spirit constantly convicted me of my sin, but I remained in it until age 28. At 28, The Lord used (of all people) Kenneth Copeland to deliver the message that brought me to repentance.
     
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  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    True, but the Pastor here seems to be holding too theology that one can claim to have been saved as a one time event, with no evidence of ever been changed!
     
  18. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    I am not sure exactly what the pastor believes.
     
  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Evidently not what the Bible teaches!
     
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