New Jack Chick booklet

LadyEagle · Nov 12, 2003

It was 40 years ago. Or do you have something more recent to tie Jack Chick to the abortion industry? That's what I'm asking.

Kathryn · Nov 12, 2003

I have no idea what Jack Chick thinks of the abortion industry. His involvement is one of publishing the books of a man who is a pioneer of the abortion industry. I would assume Jack Chick condemns abortion. Jack Chick has a comic book condemning freemasonry, yet has no problem with the fact that Avro Manhattan is a self proclaimed freemason.

LadyEagle · Nov 12, 2003

Zondervan Published a book of Manhattan's, too - Vatican Imperialism in the 20th Century, Zondervan, Michigan, 1965. Does that link Zondervan Publishing to abortion?

Kathryn · Nov 12, 2003

Zondervan Published a book of Manhattan's, too - Vatican Imperialism in the 20th Century, Zondervan, Michigan, 1965. Does that link Zondervan Publishing to abortion?
Click to expand...

No, because Zondervan Publishing dumped it, and Jack Chick. They won't even sell Jack Chick's books in their stores. Zondervan shows a lot of integrity.

http://www.cornerstonemag.com/pages/show_page.asp?228

Alberto Rivera’s False Anti-Catholic Story
(plus "The Catholic Question," by the Cornerstone staff)

By Gary Metz

Is your name on a Vatican hit list?
Is the Catholic church preparing a 20th-century Inquisition? Yes! says Alberto Rivera, who claims to have been an espionage agent for the Catholic church.
Alberto's testimony, entitled Alberto, is a "runaway best‑seller" published by Chick Publications, and is part of the "Crusader" comic book series. With the great success of Alberto, Jack Chick has now released a sequel entitled Double‑Cross.

Who Is Alberto Rivera and what is his message? Alberto tells us his story as follows: Spanish born, he was placed in a Jesuit seminary at the age of seven where he was trained for the priesthood. His Instructors taught him how to Infiltrate and destroy Protestant churches and aid the ecumenical movement. He claims he destroyed numerous Christian churches throughout the world. Then he was ordained a Jesuit priest and became a bishop. He says he worked with notable "Jesuit spies" such as Kathryn Kuhlman and Jim Jones. Because of his experience he was ordered to join the ecumenical forces under the Pope. There he says he learned that the Catholic church had secretly joined forces with the Communists, the Masons, the Illuminati, and the charismatic movement. The hypocrisy of It all was too much for him. He began to expose what Rome was planning. For this he was committed to a sanitarium. There, on the verge of death, he was converted. Since he knew too much. the Catholic
church wanted him dead, but mysteriously he was released and helped out of Spain. He then rescued his sister, a nun, from death In a British convent. He now claims to be running for his life, hunted by Jesuit assassins.

The story has created tremendous controversy: the Christian Reformed Church, Zondervan Publishers, and the Southern Baptist Sunday School Board have banned it from their bookstores. As a result of the negative response to Alberto, Jack Chick has published a special, free promotional tract In its defense. In that tract, Jack Chick states that Christian bookstores are being Infiltrated by undercover Catholic propaganda teams who pressure the owner until he "compromises with Rome and pulls Alberto out of the store." This Is compared to "the few totally committed Gospel book stores" who carry his books "because they see it is the only effective soul winning book to win Catholics that's published today."

In support of the book's truthfulness, on January 30, 1980, Alberto Rivera issued a sworn statement defendIng his allegations. Rivera declared, In part, " 'Alberto' is a true and actual account, and I will face a court ot [sic) law to prove the events actually took place. I hereby challenge anyone who would refute or try to prove the facts and information in this book are untrue." Recently, the Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights has asked the California Attorney General's office to investigate Jack T. Chick and Alberto Rivera for "false advertising and consu. mer fraud."
Is Alberto's story true? No! Our intensive investigation reveals his police record, his investment schemes, his bad check‑writing, his contradictory testimony, his fabricated educational record, and his reported family abuse.

Alberto Rivera, also known as Alberto Romero, has a history of legal entanglements. He is currently Involved in a court action In Southern California, accused of fraud. According to Cesar Ramirez, he gave Alberto over $2,000 to Invest In some property in Huntington Park, California. The property was never purchased. When Mr. Ramirez asked for his money back, Alberto gave him a donation slip for $2,0001 Ramirez has now sued him to recover his money.

In 1965, a warrant for his arrest was issued in Hoboken, New Jersey, for writing bad checks. He also left debts in excess of $3,000.
In October, 1967, Alberto went to work at the Church of God of Prophecy headquarters In Tennessee. Alberto began collecting funds for a college in Tarrassa, Spain. When the Church of God of Prophecy wrote the college to see if he was authorized to collect funds on their behalf, the church received the following reply: the college had given him a letter to collect funds, but only for the month of July. The school later discovered that while he "claimed to be a Catholic priest ... he had never been one." They reported he left debts which he had drawn in the name of the parish of San Lorenzo, and that the Spanish police were seeking him for "authentic swindles and cheats." Finally, they said no funds he raised had ever reached the college.
In a letter to the Department of Justice, Rev. Charles Hawkins of the Church of God of Prophecy stated Alberto's bank had contacted them because he had written a check to Delta Air Lines on a closed account. In 1969 two warrants were issued against him in DeLand and Ormond Beach, Florida. The first was for the theft of a Bank‑Americard. The criminal Investigation division of the Bank of America reports he charged over $2,000 on the credit card. The second warrant was for the .'unauthorized use of an automobile." Alberto abandoned the vehicle in Seattle, Washington. From there he moved to Southern California.

Alberto's account of his conversion is contradictory. In 1964 while working for the Christian Reformed Church, he said he was converted from Catholicism in July of 1952. Now he maintains it was in 1967. While speaking at the Faith Baptist Church in Canoga Park, California, Alberto pinpointed his conversion at 3:00 in the morning on March 20, 1967. He says he immediately defected from the Catholic church. However, five months later, in August of 1967, he was still promoting Catholicism and the ecumenical movement in a newspaper interview in his hometown of Las Palmas in the Canary Islands. Another discrepancy involves his three month stay in a sanitarium. In Alberto, he says he was placed in a sanitarium in 1965 for exposing the Catholic church. This would put his "conversion" and release from the sanitarium no later than April, 1966. The book Alberto lists his release as September, 1967. Alberto doesn't reveal what happened during those one and a half years. However, in the newspaper interview in Las Palmas (August 1967), he said he had been doing ecumenical work in Tarrassa, Spain, during the previous 6 months (Feb.‑Aug. 1967). This is the time he was supposed to be in a sanitarium for exposing Rome's ecumenical plot!

PRIESTHOOD

Alberto's claim to have been a Jesuit priest and bishop are denied by the Catholic church. They state that the document he exhibits as proof of his priesthood is little more than a form letter giving permission to travel abroad. The document was fraudulently obtained. Alberto's accounts of his ordination are contradictory. In 1967 when Alberto was visiting his family in Las Palmas, he said he had been ordained a priest in Costa Rica; in 1978, while at the Faith Baptist Church in Canoga Park, California, he said he was ordained In Las Palmas.

Alberto now claims that he was once a Jesuit bishop. None of his format associates remember this being part of his testimony until the early 19703. Former associate Rev. Wishart (once a pastor of the First Baptist Church of San Fernando), who questioned Alberto about this, reported that Alberto admitted that he had never been ordained a bishop, but used the title for prestige. He continues to call himself the bishop of his own church, the Hispanic Baptist Church (Oxnard, CA).

After Alberto allegedly escaped the Catholics in Madrid, DoubleCross devotes nine pages to the rescue and conversion of his sister "Maria," a nun, from a convent in London. Alberto was in London during the time mentioned in the comic (Sept. 1967), but was staying at a Catholic monastery rather than the YMCA described in Double‑Cross. Rev. Delmar Spurling (Church of God of Prophecy) picked him up at the monastery, and attests that Alberto had only one sister in London: her name wasn't Maria, she wasn't a nun, and didn't live in a convent, but in a private London home as a maid. Alberto stayed with Church of God of Prophecy members for approximately a month until his return to the U.S.

DIPLOMA MILL DEGREES

Alberto commands great respect from many with his alleged numerous degrees including an N.D., a D.D., a Th.D., a Ph.D., and a master's in psychology. However, he is ambiguous when asked where he received these degrees. Alberto attended a seminary in Costa Rica (the Seminario Biblio Latinamericano) with a friend from Las Palmas, but he did not graduate. That friend, Rev. Plutarco Bonilla (a respected Christian leader in Central America), said that Alberto never finished high school in Las Palmas and that he was in the seminary's program for non‑high school graduates. The school in a letter said they were forced to expel Alberto for his "continual lying and defiance of seminary authority," The known chronology of his life does not allow time for him to have achieved the academic status he claims. When Rev. Wishart pressed Alberto concerning his degrees, Alberto admitted receiving them from a diploma mill in Colorado. This ended their relationship. Pastor Rassmussen (Faith Baptist Church in Canoga Park, California) also asked Alberto to substantiate some of his claims by submitting to a lie detector test. Alberto said he would: three limes appointments were made for him, three times he failed to appear.

Alberto's past family relationships have been described negatively by those who knew them. He met his first "wife" in Costa Rica while working with the Methodist church. Rev. Bonilla says that Alberto was living there with a woman in the late 1950s but they weren't legally married: Alberto said God ordained their marriage. Alberto later claimed in an employment form that he and Carmen Lydia Torres were married on November 25, 1963. Their son Juan was born in Hoboken, New Jersey, in September, 1964, where Alberto was working with the Christian Reformed Church. A supervisor at the time, Rev. Edson Lewis, said that Alberto physically abused both Carmen Lydia and Juan. Less than a year after his birth, in July, 1965, Juan died in El Paso, Texas, where his parents had fled, after they wrote bad checks in New Jersey.

His marriage relationship to Carmen Lydia was further complicated as described in the letter by Rev. Charles Hawkins (Church of God of Prophecy In Tennessee) to the U.S. Department of Justice. The letter stated that Alberto and Carmen Lydia's wedding was scheduled in Tennessee in 1968, but that Carmen Lydia missed the wedding, staying in Puerto Rico instead.
Alberto then went to Puerto Rico and returned to the States with a new son, Alberto. Carmen Lydia followed them a few months later. This is according to former associate and roommate Rev. Daniel Abrego, who added that Alberto had left Carmen Lydia in Mexico when he returned to Spain in 1966. It is difficult to determine the whereabouts of the child Alberto today, but Rev. Abrego claims he was placed in a welfare home in Tennessee. They didn't have a child with them when they went to Florida in 1969.

Alberto and Carmen Lydia had still another son, Luis Marx, early in 1969. While they were in Florida, their hosts said Luis Marx was mistreated. What happened to Luis Marx is unknown, but when Alberto left Florida for Seattle with the car and credit card. they no longer had the child with them. What happened to Carmen Lydia after Seattle is also unknown, but Alberto remarried in 1977 to Nury Frias, a woman, from the Dominican Republic. Whether he was ever legally married to and/or divorced from the other woman is unknown. At any rate, it is extremely damaging to Rivera's credibility to discover that he had two children (Juan and Alberto) in America during the time he was supposed to be a celibate priest in Europe!

PAST AND PRESENT

Alberto Is known to have been affiliated with: the Methodist church, the Church of Christ, the Christian Reformed Church, the Church of God of Prophecy, and various Pentecostal and Baptist churches, as well as the controversial Universal Life Church. He has formed a number of organizations: Agapesofia Oikoumene, the Catholic Apostolic Church, the Hispanic Baptist Church (of Oxnard), and most recently the Antichrist Information Center. While Alberto claims the Antichrist Information Center is a tax‑exempt, non‑profit organization, the IRS denies It. He has also requested in his newsletter that donors not send cash because the Knights of Columbus postal employees are opening his mail.

He now lives in Ontario, California, he owns a church in Oxnard, and a service station‑grocery store in Northern California, as well as some undeveloped properties. He is gathering funds for an alleged hide‑away retreat for expriests and nuns and is asking for $110,000 more to complete this project.

What does Jack Chick think about this? It's hard to find out, because he has made it a policy not to speak with reporters. But when he was finally reached by phone at his home, he said that he had never met a more godly man than Alberto, and that he knows Alberto's story is true because he ,.prayed about it." Jack says he expects his own life to be taken by Jesuit assassins.
When we reached Alberto by phone, he also refused to meet with us. (Alberto has an office in the Chick Publications headquarters.) He claims that any wrongdoings prior to his conversion In 1967 were done under the orders of the Catholic church, and any wrongdoings since his conversion are fabrications by the conspirators.

As we have seen, Alberto's story Is fraudulent, as was the story of John Todd, another Jack Chick protege, who said the witches are taking over the world (see Issue 148 of Cornerstone). Alberto has skillfully created a closed, paranoid defense system which makes it difficult to corner him on specific issues. He can always dismiss any accusation as part of the Jesuit plot.

Is Jack naive or is he publishing these stories because they are big sellers? It's impossible to know what his motives are, but after the John Todd fiasco, he should have withdrawn those publications and should have been much more careful before publishing another sensationalistic testimony.

How should we respond? First, we need to be more discerning about what we read and what stories we promote. We should not succumb to "last days paranoia." God has promised to bring us through every situation. Last, we need to pray: for Christians who have accepted his story and are now suspicious of other Christians, for Jack Chick that he will be more responsible with his publications, and for Alberto that he will truly repent and follow Christ. *

Gary Metz has written several articles for Cornerstone ‑ "Conspiracy or Conspirator?: The John Todd Story" in Issue 48; "Angels on Assignment: Fact or Fiction?" in Issue 50; and "is Christianity a Cult?" and "Jimmy Swaggart" (regarding contemporary Christian music) in Issue 51. In addition to this article, which was funded by and researched initially for Cornerstone, the information in "The Alberto story" will be found in an upcoming issue of Christianity Today, Gary is currently working with a research organization in California.
If you have any further information about Alberto Rivera, or it you desire additional clarification regarding his story, please write to: Gary Metz c/o C.A.R.I.S. P.O. Box 1783 Santa Ana, CA 92702
Click to expand...

Kathryn · Nov 12, 2003

http://www.chick.com/reading/comics/0112/albertoinfo.asp

Jack Chick has been passing this man off as an ex-Jesuit.

RaptureReady · Nov 13, 2003

Kathryn, were did you get the idea of Stopes and Manhattan being together? The links I looked at showed nothing of them being together. Also, is there a time line of when/if they were together? I'm looking but not finding, please direct further. Maybe cut and paste.

Kathryn · Nov 13, 2003

http://www.reformation.org/avro.html

Here is some info from a Protestant website who are pushing his writings.

Kathryn · Nov 13, 2003

Here's some more links:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/decani/message/162

http://www.bunsei.co.jp/kosho/collection/stopes.htm

Book presented from Marie Stopes to Avro Manhattan
6. TIETZE-CONRAT (E.) Mantegna. Paintings-Drawings-Engravings. Complete edition. London: The Phaidon Press. 1955
Quarto. Original cloth. 257 pp. Coloured frontispiece. Illustrated, some in colour. Marie Stopes's initialled dated presentation copy to Avro Manhattan: "To Avro from M.C.S. Xmas 1955 Norbury Park". Baron Avro Manhattan was Marie Stopes's last love - her "twin soul". Although there was an age difference of nearly 35 years it was a passionate and idealistic relationship. Had they been more nearly the same age she might have found fulfilment - or perhaps not....
Together with:
Letter from Marie C. Stopes and Avro Manhattan to the Editor of The Listener. September1, 1955, p. 342 defending H.G. Wells, whose protégé Manhattan had been.

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a39033fd7784d.htm

http://www.antioch.com.sg/cgi-bin/HN_Open/get/messageboard/591.html?admin

Dates:

Maria Stope born 1880-1958 died
Avro Manhattan born 1914-1990 died

Avro Manhattan member of executive committee, Stopes Birth Control Clinic, London, 1954-59)

RaptureReady · Nov 13, 2003

So when did Chick meet Manhattan?

Kathryn · Nov 13, 2003

So when did Chick meet Manhattan?
Click to expand...

You would have to ask Jack Chick that. Jack Chick had Avro Manhattan writing articles for his newsletter the Battle Cry, besides publishing his books.

Kathryn · Nov 13, 2003

Here is another milestone date for Avro Manhattan:

Pioneer Award, American Atheists, 1976 , for world-wide education in the matter of
theo-politics;

Kathryn · Nov 13, 2003

Here is a "joint project" of Stopes and Manhattan, defending their friend H.G. Wells.

Letter from Marie C. Stopes and Avro Manhattan to the Editor of The Listener. September1, 1955, p. 342 defending H.G. Wells, whose protégé Manhattan had been.

http://www.bunsei.co.jp/kosho/collection/stopes.htm

Maria C. Stopes and Avro Manhattan writing a letter to the Editor of The Listener in 1955 defending H.G. Wells.

Christians may be interested in the hostile, anti-Christian attitude of H.G. Wells. I have his book The Outline of History. His description of Jesus Christ I found most offensive. H.G. Wells claims that Jesus was
“probably of a delicate physique, because of the swiftness with which he died under the pains of crucifixion. There is a tradition that he fainted when, according to the custom, he was made to bear his own cross to the place of execution. When he first appeared as a teacher he was a man of about thirty. He went about the country for three years spreading his doctrine and then he came to Jerusalem and was accused of trying to set up a strange kingdom in Judea; he was tried upon this charge, and crucified together with two thieves. Long before these two were dead, his sufferings were over.” Page 529 On and on, H.G Wells tries to discredit Jesus Christ as anything but a weak man. He never mentions the loss of blood from the whipping and the crowning with thorns that put Jesus in a much weaker state than the average crucifixion victim.

Johnv · Nov 13, 2003

Originally posted by HomeBound:
It's not an excuse, it's the truth. Let's see, Johnv, do you or do you not believe the bibical account of Genesis?
Click to expand...

Yes, I do. But you're a KJVO, and unless I believe in ONLY the KJV inthe manner you do, you will assert that I don't believe inthe bible. Back to the subject, please.

[ November 13, 2003, 05:27 PM: Message edited by: Johnv ]

Kathryn · Nov 13, 2003

I found this book that may have more info about the Stopes and Manhattan relationship published in the 60's. Seems both Stopes and Manhattan where not discrete or private people.

Keith Briant-, PASSIONATE PARADOX: THE LIFE OF MARIE STOPES-, W.W. Norton & Co. Publishers- Hardcover dj/ pub. 1962/ Gd. condition/285 pages-

The Noble, Tragic, and Contradictory woman who pioneered in sex education, and was a scientist and mystic, poet, playwright and Keith Briant-, PASSIONATE PARADOX: THE LIFE OF MARIE STOPES-, W.W. Norton & Co. Publishers- Hardcover dj/ pub. 1962/ Gd. condition/285 pages- The Noble, Tragic, and Contradictory woman who pioneered in sex education, and was a scientist and mystic, poet, playwright and friend to the famous men of her time. (D42404) $17.95 . (D42404) $17.95
Click to expand...

Kathryn · Nov 13, 2003

Homebound, your questions about Avro Manhattan have caused me to come up with some interesting stuff just now.

What is with Bob Jones University and Baron Avro Manhattan Trust Fund Scholarships? Baron Avro Manhattan must have had a soft spot in his heart for Bob Jones University and it's anti-Catholicism. Maybe they use his books published by Jack Chick.

http://www.bju.edu/admissions/financial/aid

Baron Avro Manhattan Trust Fund

Four scholarships @$2,500

LadyEagle · Nov 14, 2003

So is Avro Manhattan alive? Is there any recent information about his "abortion" ties? (other than something 40 years ago).

Kathryn · Nov 15, 2003

Lady Eagle:

So is Avro Manhattan alive? Is there any recent information about his "abortion" ties? (other than something 40 years ago).
Click to expand...

As I have already posted, Avro Manhattan has been dead for about 13 years.

Dates:
Avro Manhattan member of executive committee, Stopes Birth Control Clinic, London, 1954-59
Maria Stope born 1880-1958 died
Avro Manhattan born 1914-1990 died

The Maria Stopes International abortion chain that they both pioneered is worldwide and continues to grow.

http://www.mariestopes.org.uk

My point is that this link between Avro Manhattan and Maria Stopes and the abortion agenda disqualifies him as an unbiased author that he portrays himself to be. Maria Stopes was very outspoken that the Catholic Church was her enemy for its stand on birth control and abortion. The Maria Stopes International website is proud to post Maria Stope's rage towards the Catholic Church.

Her and Avro Manhattan worked together on this as shown by his being on the executive committee of the Stopes Birth Control Clinic until shortly after Maria Stopes died. If this means nothing to you, that is sad, but it does show that Avro Manhattan’ books are biased against the Catholic Church for reasons that Maria Stopes explains. The Catholic Church stood in the way of her plans and she declared war on it. The battle has been going on for over half a century and will continue.

God Bless

True Blue Tuna · Nov 15, 2003

Originally posted by Johnv:
Any booklet Jack Chick puts out is tripe.

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig.
Click to expand...

Indeed. For example, the one called "Fat Cats" was supposed to tell about the futility of miltiary revolutions.

I guess we're lucky that Chick didn't live in 1776, huh?

And funny that the USA was funding a military revolution against the Soviet-sponsored Afghan government, as well as the Nicaraguan government?

LadyEagle · Nov 16, 2003

My point is that this link between Avro Manhattan and Maria Stopes and the abortion agenda disqualifies him as an unbiased author that he portrays himself to be.
Click to expand...

So does that mean he never asked for forgiveness, never got right with God, and is burning in hell right now?

Kathryn · Nov 16, 2003

LadyEagle:
quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My point is that this link between Avro Manhattan and Maria Stopes and the abortion agenda disqualifies him as an unbiased author that he portrays himself to be.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So does that mean he never asked for forgiveness, never got right with God, and is burning in hell right now?
Click to expand...

I don't believe in judging anyone elses salvation. That is between him and God. He is however not the unbiased author that he portrayed himself to be.

God Bless

New Jack Chick booklet

LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

Kathryn New Member

LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

RaptureReady New Member

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

RaptureReady New Member

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

Johnv New Member

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

Kathryn New Member

True Blue Tuna New Member

LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

Kathryn New Member

Useful Searches

New Jack Chick booklet

LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

Kathryn New Member

LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

RaptureReady New Member

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

RaptureReady New Member

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

Johnv New Member

Kathryn New Member

Kathryn New Member

LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

Kathryn New Member

True Blue Tuna New Member

LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

Kathryn New Member