1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

No dead babies, little children, infants in Hell?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by jdlongmire, Jul 9, 2008.

?

Concerning Infants and Little Children dying in infancy:

  1. All are elect

    25 vote(s)
    67.6%

  2. Some are elect

    2 vote(s)
    5.4%

  3. Scripture is not clear on this

    8 vote(s)
    21.6%

  4. I am unsure

    2 vote(s)
    5.4%
Top Posters
Page 6 of 9
  1. JerryL

    JerryL New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2006
    Messages:
    972
    Likes Received:
    0
    Nope, I'm with you.
     
    #101 JerryL, Jul 12, 2008
  2. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    13,103
    Likes Received:
    4
    Our numbers are growing. :thumbs:
     
    #102 Amy.G, Jul 12, 2008
  3. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    You do understand that what you believe is a well-refuted heresy called Pelagianism, right?
     
    #103 jdlongmire, Jul 12, 2008
  4. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2005
    Messages:
    12,723
    Likes Received:
    0
    jdlongmire;
    You believe that God is omnipresence don't you?
    (can be at all places at once)

    You believe that God is omniscience don't you?
    (knows all things)

    Do you believe that His omnipresence and his omnicience work together for Him?

    In other words, Is God here now?
    Also, is God at the beginning of time now?
    Is God at the end of time now?
    Does God know when you will die now?

    If you believe all these things about God, then God is here now, He sees now who believes in Christ. He also is at the beginning now. So now, while here and also in the beginning, knowing now who believes in Jesus, He knows who to predestinate doesn't He. What great mystery is that? An all knowing God, is right now, at my resurrection, also at the beginning of time. What great thing is it for God to see my long white robe in the resurrection and at the beginning of time, at the same time???

    BBob,
     
    #104 Brother Bob, Jul 12, 2008
  5. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    13,103
    Likes Received:
    4
    That is not what I believe.

    How do you interpret this verse:

    Rom 7:9 I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died.


    Paul is obviously talking about spiritual death, so how did he die if he was already dead?
     
    #105 Amy.G, Jul 12, 2008
  6. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    Bro Bob -

    1) God, the Father is independent of time, so this illustration is not relevant.

    2) The Father gives the elect, whom he has foreknown, to Christ

    The crux of the matter is how one understands "foreknown".

    Foreknow as it relates to God is not like prophecy, where one speaks of future events before they happen. Foreknow in the scriptural sense is active, not passive. When God "foreknows" something, it is a decree of His sovereign will.

    That is - there is not a set of circumstances that can occur that will stop a foreknown event from occurring.

    God foreknows His elect. Not based on "before knowing" some future event, but divinely and sovereignly decreeing "thus shall it be". He foreknows us in eternity, so we are and shall be.
     
    #106 jdlongmire, Jul 12, 2008
  7. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    He was a "dead man walking" - he was not (and all the elect, pre-regeneration, are not) aware of his spiritual death until exposed to the Law through the Spirit.

    from here
     
    #107 jdlongmire, Jul 12, 2008
  8. Cutter

    Cutter New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2006
    Messages:
    1,564
    Likes Received:
    0
    2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

    "Any" and "all" in the verse of scripture above gives everyone that hears the gospel the opportunity to be saved. If only the elect can be saved then it would conflict with the fact that, "the Lord is... not willing that any should perish..."
    If He is not willing that any should perish, yet He has already decided who will hear and be saved takes some twisting of scripture.
     
    #108 Cutter, Jul 12, 2008
  9. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    Let's put this in context, please - bold are my notes:


    Alot more consistent in context.


    Twisting?

    Psalm 95:7
    For He is our God,And we are the people of His pasture and the sheep of His hand Today, if you would hear His voice,


    John 10:3
    "To him the doorkeeper opens, and the sheep hear his voice, and he calls his own sheep by name and leads them out.


    John 10:16
    "I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will hear My voice; and they will become one flock with one shepherd.


    John 10:27
    "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; (note the order, there...)


    Again, context, context, context...
     
    #109 jdlongmire, Jul 12, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 12, 2008
  10. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jdlongmire
    You do understand that what you believe is a well-refuted heresy called Pelagianism, right?

    If you don't believe that infants are born under the curse of Original Sin and justly condemned for that alone, you do.
     
    #110 jdlongmire, Jul 12, 2008
  11. Cutter

    Cutter New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2006
    Messages:
    1,564
    Likes Received:
    0

    Nice try mister, but your bold type and adding to scripture does not overrule what the Word of God says. You cherry pick scripture to support calvinism when you have to take the whole of the Word of God.
     
    #111 Cutter, Jul 12, 2008
  12. Cutter

    Cutter New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2006
    Messages:
    1,564
    Likes Received:
    0
    Thank God the calvinists cannot remove, "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved," from the Word! Amen!
     
    #112 Cutter, Jul 13, 2008
  13. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    duplicate delete
     
    #113 jdlongmire, Jul 13, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 13, 2008
  14. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    duplicate delete
     
    #114 jdlongmire, Jul 13, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 13, 2008
  15. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    good grief - please...I am illuminating what is there, not adding anything - feel free to rebut using the same scripture - you can't - God is not saving the reprobate (the ungodly men) - He is saving His beloved (the elect).
     
    #115 jdlongmire, Jul 13, 2008
  16. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yeah, but we understand from the breadth of Scripture that only the elect will call.
     
    #116 jdlongmire, Jul 13, 2008
  17. Cutter

    Cutter New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2006
    Messages:
    1,564
    Likes Received:
    0
    Oh, so you have exposed yourself! The Bible needs your illumination??? PLEASE!
    You need to repent and ask God to let the Holy Spirit open your eyes to the truth and get yourself out of the way!

    God said, I AM, then along comes little ol' jdlongmire and says, I am... your funny. :laugh:
     
    #117 Cutter, Jul 13, 2008
  18. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    13,103
    Likes Received:
    4
    Which is it? Are infants elect or not? You have infants being condemned and being elect at the same time.
     
    #118 Amy.G, Jul 13, 2008
  19. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2001
    Messages:
    378
    Likes Received:
    0
    Mocker, do you not believe that teachers can help in the illumination of the teaching of Scripture or are you autonomous?
     
    #119 jdlongmire, Jul 13, 2008
  20. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    13,103
    Likes Received:
    4
    That's not what the Bible says.


    Mat 9:13 But go and learn what [this] means: 'I desire mercy and not sacrifice.' For I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance."*

    Mar 2:17 When Jesus heard [it], He said to them, "Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. I did not come to call [the] righteous, but sinners, to repentance."*


    Luk 5:32 I have not come to call [the] righteous, but sinners, to repentance."


    Rom 5:8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.


    1Ti 1:15 This [is] a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief.
     
    #120 Amy.G, Jul 13, 2008
(You must log in or sign up to post here.)
Page 6 of 9
Loading...