Obama may be REQUIRED to show birth certificate in 2012

If the police stop you while you are walking down the street for for suspicion of anything regardless of your race they will ask you for your id.

 

Yes, which is one reason why it is a good idea to carry ID. But it is not a crime in and of itself to not carry ID. You are, in Florida, required to to give your name if stopped by police, but you're not required to carry ID unless you're driving.

 

Do you even know what the law says specifically? Everyone who is not a citizen has to show proof of legality regardless of race. But liberals have been working to avoid this and blocking all efforts to enforce the laws already on the books.

 

Yes. Federal law requires all non-citizens to carry ID/green card on their persons at all times. You should stop stereotyping. I'm a liberal and I don't have a problem with that. Back before my Hispanic grandmother became a citizen in 1994 she had to carry her green card with her.

 

So then how is it liberals come to the conclusion this Arizona law is racism or any different then any fed law. That question was rhetorical

 

Because how are you going to tell between an illegal alien and a citizen of the wrong color? You said that based on your experience as a military policeman that there are behavioral ways to tell. I believe you, but I still have two issues with the bill. The first is that it leaves too much room for abuse. The second is that I don't think not having the papers provides probable cause one is an illegal alien.

 

I am a HUGE state's rightist, but this whole thing sorta reminds me of the Irish garda (policeman) who was going to arrest President Bush for international war crimes when he visited here.

 

It is simply politicians playing for votes ... a calculated gamble that may cost the politicians more than they gain. It has certainly polarized the people of the state. While it may have bought them a few votes it has also cost them votes.

 

Any person, including you if you are there, can be stopped and asked to produce documentation showing they are legal. How would you prove, on the street, that you are legal? Are you going to carry your birth certificate or passport with you at all times?

 

Everyone has a right to remain silent and to consult a lawyer before talking to the police. Everyone has a right to ask the police if he is under arrest and to walk away if he isn't. But for most people it is easier and cheaper to go along with the system. I expect for all you constitutionalists to put your money where your mouth is and test the Constitution for yourselves.

 

That's mostly true. Under Terry vs. Ohio you can be detained without arrest for a reasonable period of time with reasonable suspicion. If that happens, most states require you to identify yourself.

 

Only in your mind could Republicans finally do something about illegal immigration...and you blame them for it.

Of course, it would have been their fault if they had done nothing. Or given amnesty. Or anything else.

 

Do you KNOW for a fact that this is so?

I mean.... the police can ask anything of you.... as can any other person: Whether you comply or not is according to your discretion and whether you know your rights and exercise them.

The police cannot lawfully compel you to produce an ID, (provided that state law doesn't require it to be available at ALL TIMES) unless you meet their 'reasonable suspicion' criteria: Reasonable suspicion does not include ethnic profiling nor race nor suspicion of being an alien, either legal or illegal (in most instances). 'Reasonable suspicion' may include persons within the proximity of a crime who might either be witness or involved; an infraction of law be it pedestrian conduct ('jay-walking' where laws are routinely enforced), public drunkeness or misconduct; an infraction involving a vehicle (for example... improper parking, operating infraction, improper or burned out lights, tag expiration); a person meeting the description of a suspect to a crime; not to mention the witnessing of a crime or a behavior strongly suggestive of a crime taking place. In some cases, fleeing from an officer is accepted by the courts as increasing any prior 'reasonable suspicion' which they might have had.... to elevate it to the level of justifying a persuit and apprehension, even IF their first 'reasonable suspicion' later proved to be unjustified..... because the behavior pattern of the fleeing person did not match that of a person who was lawfully sound and had no reason to not give minimal cooperation to a law enforcement officer in the conduct of his duties.

A passenger in a car is only expected to tell the officer his name if asked: If asked for an ID, he may refuse to produce it if he is not in a state which requires everyone keep their ID with them: Even if the driver consents to a search of the car..... the passenger may take possession of his own purse or belongings and identify such to the officer and refuse a search of those items if based upon lack of 'reasonable suspicion'. He may ask if he is being detained or if he is free to go.

The county and state LEO, are held to a higher standard of conduct by their oath to the constitution. A city or municipalities police force may not be required to take that oath.... in which case.... a person's 'rights' may be violated.... not without impunity.... BUT, a person in that situation is wise to recognize the difference, acknowledge his rights but cooperate so as not to provoke an incident... and let the laundry air later ...if he has a case worth the effort.

Thus, we see, there is an area where an illegal alien may increase the likelihood of required producing an ID, or avoid many areas where such could be required. (Provided, of course, that the state doesn't have statues requiring ID be producible at all times.)

--------At least this is what I understand to the best of my knowledge.

 

You don't know what I believe about this, so don't assume.

Amnesty sounds like the right thing for this problem.