1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Pelagianism

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by evangelist6589, May 20, 2013.

  1. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    9,815
    Likes Received:
    141
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Is this not the theology that says man can choose God without the Holy Spirit? In the past I have preached this lie because I was ignorant of what I was saying, I was influenced by Arminian like Norm Geisler and Mark Cahill, and I was in error. I will admit that I am not perfect and have not arrived. But thee days I clearly see that man it TOTALLY DEPRAVED and cannot choose God without the Holy Spirit. God brings his converts and man cannot by his own will choose the Holy Spirit.

    I appreciate it when people show me grace and show me through strong arguments of my error. I do not like it when christian condemn me to the fire for being in error in these kinds of matters. I also do not like it when Christians condemn me because I have books by some Arminian. Some on Facebook have been quick to condemn me and I do not appreciate it. This board seems to have more grace and more argumentation over Facebook where I can get unfriended and quickly condemned.
     
    #1 evangelist6589, May 20, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: May 20, 2013
  2. SolaSaint

    SolaSaint Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,824
    Likes Received:
    25
    I pray you do receive grace here, but I will not hold my breath since Calvinism is considered a bad word on this site. God Bless.

    oops, let me edit..you didn't say Calvinism, I assumed it. Do you consider yourself a Calvinist?
     
  3. convicted1

    convicted1 Guest

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2007
    Messages:
    9,012
    Likes Received:
    6
    This is non-sequitor because none adhere to Pelagianism on here....or at least I haven't seen one who does.
     
  4. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    9,815
    Likes Received:
    141
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I deny Limited Atonement but otherwise I agree with Calvinism, except for Eschatology.
     
  5. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,691
    Likes Received:
    0
    Do you have even one source showing that Pelagius taught that, or that any Arminian believes that? That charge has been made too many times without anything backing it. I've never heard anyone, ever, state the Holy Spirit is unnecessary in man coming to God.

    BTW, many things are attributed to the error of Pelagius' teaching. I was challenged to find any of his work supporting these charges. All I have found were third hand sources saying what he believed.
     
    #5 webdog, May 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2013
  6. Thomas Helwys

    Thomas Helwys New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2013
    Messages:
    1,892
    Likes Received:
    0
    Right. Even Pelagius did not believe what his opponents charge him with. And if I had to choose between him and Augustine, I would choose him because Augustine's pagan-influenced teachings are a blight on Christianity. Fortunately, there are other teachings to choose from.
     
  7. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    40,135
    Likes Received:
    1,048
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Hey, here is a thought. Study the Bible for yourself, follow after the doctrines of God and quit following after the doctrines of men. That ends all the discussion about who follows who and what kind of influence any of them had.
     
  8. Skandelon

    Skandelon <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2003
    Messages:
    9,638
    Likes Received:
    0
    Allow me to ask you some questions to clarify what I believe to be the REAL issue at hand:

    1. Was the Gospel inspired by the Holy Spirit?
    2. Has the Gospel been perserved over the years by the Holy Spirit?
    3. Is the Gospel today still carried by Holy Spirit indwelled people to the world?

    If you answered yes to all these questions, then how can you conclude that someone confronted by this same Gospel is 'acting on his own' or 'without the Holy Spirit?'
     
  9. preachinjesus

    preachinjesus Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2004
    Messages:
    7,406
    Likes Received:
    99
    What he said. :applause::applause::thumbsup::thumbsup:
     
  10. Winman

    Winman Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2009
    Messages:
    14,768
    Likes Received:
    1
    I believe Pelagius has been, and continues to be completely misrepresented by his opponents, especially Calvinists. I doubt that many Roman Catholics have ever heard of Pelagius, while I do not know of one Calvinist who does NOT KNOW of Pelagius.

    Source- http://www.libraryoftheology.com/writings/pelagianism/ThePelagianBoogieMan-JonathanDutweiller.pdf
     
    #10 Winman, May 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2013
  11. MB

    MB Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2006
    Messages:
    2,699
    Likes Received:
    24
    This would settle a lot of arguments wouldn't it? A men
    MB
     
  12. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    9,815
    Likes Received:
    141
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Do you read books? Or are you one of those types that says "I do not read books I only read the Bible?" A author may not directly say that, but by what he writes I know exactly what he believes, even if he does not directly claim something. No one deceived will directly admit it.

    Some books

    Conversational Evangelism
    One heartbeat away

    Norm Geisler and Mark Cahill are Arminian and who think that human efforts, methods, evidences, and such are what brings people to salvation. They do not believe in the sovereignty of God in salvation.
     
    #12 evangelist6589, May 21, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2013
  13. Don

    Don Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2000
    Messages:
    10,828
    Likes Received:
    271
    Faith:
    Baptist
    In your first post, you seem to use arminian and pelagian interchangeably. Do you consider then the same thing?
     
  14. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    9,815
    Likes Received:
    141
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes
    Yes
    Yes

    I am not sure I understand your question. All I know is from what the Bible teaches and that is that God brings the converts and man responds. No I do not believe in hmm.... I am running a blank but the doctrine taught by Hyper Calvinists that God forces people to believe in him? Whats the name of that doctrine? I am running a blank. Quite simple man has some free-will but God takes responsibility for bringing people to salvation.
     
  15. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    9,815
    Likes Received:
    141
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes it would. On another topic of debate I have had with someone offline this would settle it as this person is following traditions and what the pastor says, rather than what the Bible says.
     
  16. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    9,815
    Likes Received:
    141
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No. They are similar however.
     
  17. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,691
    Likes Received:
    0
    No, I am not opposed to books. I do think what you present is a false dichotomy. Grace is not opposed to effort, grace is opposed to earning.
     
  18. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    9,815
    Likes Received:
    141
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Eph 2:8-10 says that Grace is not dependent on myself. Do you not believe this? Yes Grace is opposed to those that think they earn Gods favor by their efforts. Like those that dress up to church everyweek to make an impression on God.
     
  19. webdog

    webdog Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    24,691
    Likes Received:
    0
    Which begs the question, which system or person teaches dependence on self?
     
  20. Skandelon

    Skandelon <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2003
    Messages:
    9,638
    Likes Received:
    0
    My point is the the GOSPEL is a work of the Holy Spirit, so to suggest there needs to be an additional working of the Holy Spirit for a man to believe the GOSPEL seems redundant at best.
     
Loading...