Pink...the Atonement, 1 Jn2:2

Why Are So Many Seventh-day Adventists
Leaving the SDA Church?



In 2005, the SDA Church reported alarming membership losses. Despite adding 5 million new believers during the 5-year period of 2000-2004, over 1.4 million members left the church during that same period.2

SDA minister Vance Ferrell describes the problem in his newsletter:

"That is a very high loss. According to the official report, 'for every 100 accessions, more than 35 others decided to leave.' This was a significant increase over the 24 per 100 which left in the preceding five year period (1995-1999). The drop rate has increased by almost one-half.
"A sheet distributed at one of the booths said that '70 percent of young people in developing nations drop out of the church.'

"One missionary declared that, in his field, 'a third are dropped from the membership rolls; another third are on the rolls but no longer attend; and only a third are active members.' That one-third which remains on the rolls but no longer attends is significant. It is clear that membership totals are not a true indicator of the actual number of members in the world church.

"The statistical report, presented at the Session, lists the Southern-Asia Pacific Division (SSD) as having the highest drop rate in the world. It is 104.75%. This means that 104.75% of the number of membership increase in the SSD between spring 2000 and spring 2004 have left the church. That is more than 100%! ... In that time period, the SSD lost more members than it brought into the church."2



Why do so many people leave the SDA Church?
There are a myriad of reasons for why people leave the SDA Church, but in recent years, one reason has begun to stand out above all others: Knowledge. With easy access to the Internet, Adventist members have at their fingertips a wealth of knowledge about the teachings of the Seventh-day Adventist Church. Thanks to former SDA ministers such as Elder Dale Ratzlaff, Elder Sydney Cleveland, Elder Walter Rea, Dr. Desmond Ford, and many others, a wealth of knowledge regarding the fallacies of Seventh-day Adventism is now available to anyone willing to take the time and effort to study their religion.

Adventists are often sucked into the SDA Church through cleverly disguised and advertised evangelistic campaigns held in a public locations with no mention that the meetings are organized by Seventh-day Adventists. The multimedia presentations are designed to appeal to the senses and the emotions. End-time prophecies are presented in such a way as to arouse alarm and fear. Participants are bombarded with proof texts and one-sided arguments until they are convinced of the necessity of joining God's “one and only true remnant” church: Seventh-day Adventism.

Later, after the rush of excitement fades, these new Adventists start asking questions. It is not long before it dawns on many of these new arrivals that all may not be exactly as they had been told. Cracks begin to appear in the once-thought-to-be ironclad presentations of SDA Bible prophecy. They start asking questions, and instead of getting answers, they find that their questions are getting dodged. They soon discover there is a large and growing segment of Adventists who do not believe in Ellen White, or the peculiar SDA views of Bible prophecy. And yet, these are often the very reason the new arrivals joined the SDA Church! It is not long before they discover there are different factions in the SDA Church, each with their own idea of “truth”. As they begin examining the SDA doctrines more closely, they soon discover that there is a BIG difference between Bible Truth and SDA truth. More and more, Adventists are now "studying their way out" of Adventism.

Below are some of the Top Reasons cited by Adventists who study their way out of the SDA Church:

• "Ellen White was a false prophet."
• "Support for their Sanctuary Doctrine cannot be found in the Bible."
• "There is no Biblical evidence for an Investigative Judgment."
• "They continually and repeatedly ask me for more money!"
• "The Veggie diet is never promoted in the Scriptures!"
• "Their prophecy & National Sunday Law teachings are absurd."

NOTES

1. Vance Ferrell, More WAYMARKS - from PILGRIMS REST, "The 2005 St. Louis Session: Items of Interest General Conference Sessions: WM1305, "2005 ST. LOUIS SESSION: ITEMS OF INTEREST Nov 05 Index: General Conference Sessions / St. Louis".

2. Ibid.

 

Deconverting from the Seventh Day Adventist Church - The Truth

Yahoo Video Search

 

I want to see @BobRyan 's name on a similar letter before the end of the year.

 

These YouTube videos from ex-SDA members and pastors are so powerful — their truth so compelling, any SDA who wants to remain SDA can't watch them. Just ask Bob.

 

I'm sorry for ruffling some feathers especially professor Tom who has so vast a store of knowledge.

I certainly don't consider myself his equal by any means.

But we have disagreements in some of the details here and there.

Plus I'm in my mid 70's and still a mugwump in many areas.

 

You'll grow out of it.

 

OH, there's hope! :Cool

 

God is offended and insulted by sin.. and rebellion.

AND God is the one tormented and tortured in the "Atoning Sacrifice".

 

BobRyan said: ↑
That is a possible meaning for the Greek pagan concept of the village that "so sacrifices its goat at the mouth of volcano as to appease the angry deity that would destroy them".

But the Bible definition for atonement is "God so LOVED that HE gave..". John 3:16

It is not "God getting paid until He is happy" -- it is God getting tortured on behalf of the guilty sinner.
Incredibly obvious to every single person here.

That "harrumph!" style bible-vacuous response is not as "unexpected" from Calvinists when they are stuck by confrontation with scripture -- as some would imagine.



"BobRyan, post: 2399304

Isaiah 5:4
What more could have been done for my vineyard
than I have done for it?
When I looked for good grapes,
why did it yield only bad?


Matthew 23
37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. 38 Look, your house is left to you desolate. 39 For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.


Or the elect - being lost?

John 1:11 "He came to His OWN and His OWN received Him not"

Utter nonsense - is offerred each time we quote the Bible?

Seriously??

What do you want me to do - starting quoting all the ex-Baptists in the SDA church today?? What does that prove??

Please be serious. Choose the Bible.

in Christ,

Bob

 

LOL -- that's in 2005 back when we used to be SMALLER than the SBC.

History of the Seventh-day Adventist Church - Wikipedia

Hint: -- please try not to make this "TOO easy" for me ...




Seventh-day Adventists compose one-half of 1 percent of the U.S. adult population, and 1.2 million people in the North America belong to the denomination. But around the world there are 18.1 million SDAs, making them a larger global presence than the Southern Baptist Convention (15.5 million), the United Methodist Church (12.8 million), or Mormonism (15.3 million).

From source: 9 Things You Should Know About Seventh-day Adventism


In fact Christianity Today reported this in 2015
from source: Adventists: Can Ben Carson's Church Stay Separatist?

" In 2014, for the 10th year in a row, more than 1 million people became Adventists, hitting a record 18.1 million members. Adventism is now the fifth-largest Christian communion worldwide, after Catholicism, Eastern Orthodoxy, Anglicanism, and the Assemblies of God."


In fact that "more than 1 million per year" number reported in 2014 was "For the 10th year in a row, more than 1 million people joined the church — 1,091,222 to be exact"

Which is almost "exactly" 3000 people a day average.

Pentecost - Acts 2: 41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.

Happens every day - world wide in the Adventist denomination

March 2017
Propelled by Total Member Involvement, Adventist Church tops 20 million members
A record number of people join the church, as local churches are planted rapidly to nurture new members.

Propelled by Total Member Involvement, Adventist Church tops 20 million members

Turns out - sticking with the Bible and not responding to scripture with vitriol and acrymony -- works!

 

Ok... So, in what way is the Father appeased by the Son?

The Archangel

 

If that were actually true - then those opposing the SDA church should be able to watch those videos and "come up with a point" to post on BB.

Still waiting to see that happen "in real life"...

 

Looks like we found a post sequence that we both enjoy.

Nice when that happens.

 

I never claimed the Father was "appeased" by the Son. Do you have a quote of me saying that?

I keep claiming "God so LOVED the world that HE GAVE" John 3:16... you saw that right?
"God was IN CHRIST reconciling the World to Himself" 2 Cor 5..

I keep posting scripture - Calvinists keep saying they find these basic Gospel details in scripture - confusing.

 

Sure, I saw your posts... But, with John 3:16 especially, there is no "atonement" discussed.

Here's another question: If God is the offended party, and we seem to agree on this, how does He become unoffended?

The Archangel

 

If your argument is that the 1 John 3:16 act of God giving up His Son to die for the sins of the world has nothing to do with your concept of "atonement" you have departed a very long way from the Bible definition of it. Tell us how you did that. I find your logic most "illusive" at that point.

 

One clue as stated in my post - the path to "not offending" God is not "MORE TORTURE and torment for GOD"... can we get agreement on "the obvious"??

Atonement is not about "appeasement of an offended God".

Atonement is of the form "God so LOVED that HE GAVE His only begotten Son" as the remedy for our sin problem

This is a "Gospel basic"

 

"BobRyan,

In the fifth place, the above interpretation is confirmed by the fact that no other is consistent or intelligible. If the “whole world” signifies the whole human race, then the first clause and the “also” in the second clause are absolutely meaningless. If Christ is the propitiation for every-body, it would be idle tautology to say, first, “He is the propitiation for our sins and also for everybody“. There could be no “also” if He is the propitiation for the entire human family. Had the apostle meant to affirm that Christ is a universal propitiation he had omitted the first clause of verse 2, and simply said, “He is the propitiation for the sins of the whole world.” Confirmatory of “not for ours (Jewish believers) only, but also for the whole world“-Gentile believers, too; compare John 10:16; 17:20.
AWPINK

 

ibid
In the seventh place, to insist that “the whole world” in 1 John 2:2signifies the entire human race is to undermine the very foundations of our faith. If Christ is the propitiation for those that are lost equally as much as for those that are saved, then what assurance have we that believers too may not be lost? If Christ is the propitiation for those now in hell, what guarantee have I that I may not end in hell? The blood-shedding of the incarnate Son of God is the only thing which can keep any one out of hell, and if many for whom that precious blood made propitiation are now in the awful place of the damned, then may not that blood prove inefficacious for me! Away with such a God-dishonoring thought.