Plame Outed by Husband, Joe Wilson!

Enoch · Nov 10, 2005

Bir
Thank you, so why am I not being paid the big bucks , since I do not listen to either one. Here’s the deal if you read the indictment, (which sounds like you have not) a person can decipher the factual information. Perhaps why Limbaugh and Hannity are saying the very same thing.

church mouse guy · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by Matt Black:
And this detracts from Libby's alleged guilt how, exactly? It seems rather akin to pleading that you're not guilty of murder even though you plunged a knife into someone by virtue of the fact that someone else had fatally stabbed them 10 minutes earlier and they were already bleeding to death when you stuck your knife in.
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Way over the top for an attorney. There was no law broken because the law dealt with covert agents.

carpro · Nov 10, 2005

Another one:

http://john-batchelor.redstate.org/story/2005/11/6/235210/851

WEST POINT RALLIES AGANST WILSON
By: John Batchelor · Section: Diaries

WEST POINT RALLIES AGAINST WILSON.
Lt. General Tom McInerney, USAF (ret), West Point '59, will join his colleague Maj. General Paul Vallely, USA (ret), West Point '61 , on my show Monday 7 November (1005 pm Eastern Time on ABC Radio Network) to repeat and expand upon Vallely's memory that Joe Wilson more than once in 2002 in the green room at Fox New Channel in Washington D.C. boasted about his wife the "CIA desk officer." McInerney has the same memory and more, since both he and Vallely were on FNC between 150 and 200 times in 2002 each.

Daisy · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by church mouse guy:
Way over the top for an attorney. There was no law broken because the law dealt with covert agents.
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Do you think there is only one law concerning agents?

Bunyon · Nov 10, 2005

I think there is the letter of the law, and there is the spirit of the law. If Wilson openly told everyone who would listen his wife was a cia agent and then goes and makes a partison issue out of the so called leak, then I think it is safe to dimiss him as a political hack on the payroll of the democratic party.

Daisy · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by Bunyon:
I think there is the letter of the law, and there is the spirit of the law. If Wilson openly told everyone who would listen his wife was a cia agent and then goes and makes a partison issue out of the so called leak, then I think it is safe to dimiss him as a political hack on the payroll of the democratic party.
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Uh-huh, that is what the White House is hoping.

If it were so commonly known, why did the White House go to the trouble of outing her?

Bunyon · Nov 10, 2005

They did not out her and no one has said the did including the special counsel.

Where have you been Daisy the last few days. I have missed you.

Daisy · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by carpro:
...Lt. General Tom McInerney... will join his colleague Maj. General Paul Vallely... on my show... to repeat and expand upon Vallely's memory that Joe Wilson more than once in 2002 in the green room at Fox New Channel in Washington D.C. boasted about his wife the "CIA desk officer." McInerney has the same memory and more, since both he and Vallely were on FNC between 150 and 200 times in 2002 each.
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John Arnato has posted a schedule of Wilson's and Vallely's appearances on Fox News here (linkie). Does either Wilson or Vallely make a habit of hanging out in Fox's green room when he is NOT scheduled to appear (because they evidently didn't appear on the same day in 2002)? Perhaps Arnato is mistaken - what month, week, day does Vallely claim Wilson told him in the green room?

Originally posted by Bunyon:
They did not out her and no one has said the did including the special counsel.
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I've heard/read nothing but Libby outted Plame although that is not what he was indicted on.

<snip>
Following an op-ed piece by Wilson denouncing Bush's speech in The New York Times, columnist Robert Novak wrote a piece that identified Plame by name as a CIA agent. Wilson has long asserted that his wife's cover was blown in retaliation for his criticism of the administration.

Two other reporters - Matthew Cooper of Time magazine and Judith Miller of The New York Times - were also told of Plame's identity by Bush administration officials, who have since been identified as Libby and Deputy Chief of Staff and Senior Advisor to the President Karl Rove.

The outing of a covert espionage agent is a federal offense under US law. But Fitzgerald has so far only accused Libby of a cover-up.

Libby's appearance in Washington on Thursday came as much of the core of the Bush administration was in Argentina for the Summit of the Americas, a regional meeting of democratic western hemisphere leaders. There has been intense speculation that Rove, Bush's top aide, may also be indicted in connection with the investigation, but Fitzgerald has only said he would continue to inquire into Rove's role in the case.

According to the indictment against Libby, Cheney's top aide began looking into Wilson in May, well before the former ambassador's 6 July 2003 piece in the NY Times. Libby knew by 11 June 2003 that Wilson's wife worked at the CIA and that she may have been instrumental in setting up the trip to Niger.

On 12 June 2003, the indictment says, Cheney told Libby that Plame worked for the CIA. Fitzgerald noted that Cheney had learned of this from the agency. Shortly after this, it continued, Libby began telling reporters about Plame.

New reports said Libby had told investigators that his information had come from Tim Russert, the respected journalist for NBC, who has denied that claim.

<snip>
By Krishnadev Calamur in Washington, DC

Source: ISN SECURITY WATCH (04/11/2005) (linkie)
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But the federal charges leveled Friday against I. Lewis Libby, chief of staff to Vice President Dick Cheney, hinge in part on conversations that he had with three reporters - Judith Miller of The New York Times, Tim Russert of NBC News and Matthew Cooper of Time magazine.

<snip>

Still, the columnist who outed Plame as an undercover agent, the Chicago Sun-Times' Robert Novak, is barely mentioned in the 22-page indictment. It only states that in early July 2003 Novak learned of Plame, whose husband had criticized the war, from a senior White House official. That official has been identified by prosecutors only as "Official A."

In a news conference in Washington, special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald refused to say whether Novak cooperated with the leak probe. In addition, Fitzgerald said that Miller, not Novak, was "the first reporter to be told ... [Plame] worked at the CIA," and that Libby allegedly told her this.

Libby allegedly spoke about Plame to Miller, who never wrote a story, on three occasions and once to Cooper, who did write a story after Plame had been outed by Novak. A Time magazine spokesman did not return a telephone call and a New York Times spokeswoman declined to comment.

Source: Newsday: October 29, 2005: JAMES T. MADORE (linkie)
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Or do you consider Libby not to have been part of the White House?

Where have you been Daisy the last few days. I have missed you.
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Back at 'cha

carpro · Nov 10, 2005

It would have been kind of hard to indict Libby for releasing her employment with the CIA when Blabbermouth Joe Wilson had been sharing it, apparently, with anyone who would listen, including two very credible retired generals who have no reason to lie.

It is at least possible that Wilson himself so weakened the case against Libby that Fitzgerald found it impossible to indict Libby for outing a covert agent. Her husband had already made sure her status was not "covert".

General Vallely is willing to testify under oath. Something Joe Wilson has not done concerning this issue or the trip to Niger.

carpro · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by Daisy:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
...Lt. General Tom McInerney... will join his colleague Maj. General Paul Vallely... on my show... to repeat and expand upon Vallely's memory that Joe Wilson more than once in 2002 in the green room at Fox New Channel in Washington D.C. boasted about his wife the "CIA desk officer." McInerney has the same memory and more, since both he and Vallely were on FNC between 150 and 200 times in 2002 each.
Click to expand...

John Arnato has posted a schedule of Wilson's and Vallely's appearances on Fox News here (linkie). Does either Wilson or Vallely make a habit of hanging out in Fox's green room when he is NOT scheduled to appear (because they evidently didn't appear on the same day in 2002)? Perhaps Arnato is mistaken - what month, week, day does Vallely claim Wilson told him in the green room?

[/QUOTE]I don't know myself, but Wilson seems to think they met in the green room.

In Wilson's email to his attorney (inadvertantly sent to Vallely and Fox) dated 11-5-2005 at 5:11 PM, Wilson stated:

“This is slanderous. I never appeared on tv before at least July 2002 and only saw him maybe twice in the green room at Fox."

Bunyon · Nov 10, 2005

"I've heard/read nothing but Libby outted Plame although that is not what he was indicted on."----------------------------------------------------

You simply can't out someone who is outed already. Besides, it has been repeatedly pointed out that she probably does not meet the legal definition for a covert agent according to the law that would have to be used to indict anyone for outing.

Libby was most likely trying to avoid putting fuel on the political fires by being dishonest. Given the attempted push on this issue during the election, I sympathize with him.

He was checking into her Job status becasue the White House was trying to figure out how a democratic operative like Wilson was sent on such a sensitive mission that he clearly used for political purposes. I compeltely understand what the white house was trying to do.

Baptist in Richmond · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by Enoch:
Bir
Thank you, so why am I not being paid the big bucks , since I do not listen to either one.
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Interesting that your comments are virtually in lockstep with both Sean and Rush, especially when you claim that you do not listen to either one....

Here’s the deal if you read the indictment, (which sounds like you have not) a person can decipher the factual information.
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Yes, as a matter of fact, I have. It is readily available.

A point worth noting is that you didn't address my question to you........

Perhaps why Limbaugh and Hannity are saying the very same thing.
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I have my own theories as to why that is the case.

Regards,
BiR

Baptist in Richmond · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by carpro:
Sorry, Daisy. No one ever revealed or stated she was a "covert" agent. It was simply revealed she worked for the CIA.
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Are you sure about that?

As it turns out, there is every reason to believe she did not meet the criteria set by the law to be considered a "covert" agent.
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That's funny: that is not the impression I got from the indictment....

Baptist in Richmond · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by carpro:
Another one:

http://john-batchelor.redstate.org/story/2005/11/6/235210/851

WEST POINT RALLIES AGANST WILSON
By: John Batchelor · Section: Diaries

WEST POINT RALLIES AGAINST WILSON.
Lt. General Tom McInerney, USAF (ret), West Point '59, will join his colleague Maj. General Paul Vallely, USA (ret), West Point '61 , on my show Monday 7 November (1005 pm Eastern Time on ABC Radio Network) to repeat and expand upon Vallely's memory that Joe Wilson more than once in 2002 in the green room at Fox New Channel in Washington D.C. boasted about his wife the "CIA desk officer." McInerney has the same memory and more, since both he and Vallely were on FNC between 150 and 200 times in 2002 each.
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From the indictment, page 3:
f. Joseph Wilson was married to Valerie Plame Wilson (“Valerie Wilson”). At all relevant times from January 1, 2002 through July 2003, Valerie Wilson was employed by the CIA, and her employment status was classified. Prior to July 14, 2003, Valerie Wilson’s affiliation with the CIA was not common knowledge outside the intelligence community.
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Source

carpro · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
Sorry, Daisy. No one ever revealed or stated she was a "covert" agent. It was simply revealed she worked for the CIA.
Click to expand...

Are you sure about that?

As it turns out, there is every reason to believe she did not meet the criteria set by the law to be considered a "covert" agent.
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That's funny: that is not the impression I got from the indictment.... [/QUOTE]That's the impression I got from the lack of an indictment for doing so.

Enoch · Nov 10, 2005

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
Interesting that your comments are virtually in lockstep with both Sean and Rush, especially when you claim that you do not listen to either one....
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Thank you Bir for the compliment, I guess I should start my own show.

A point worth noting is that you didn't address my question to you........
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A point worth noting…Sorry, I find inconsiderate to sidetrack a thread. Perhaps you could start your own thread concerning your topic of choice if you truly want to discuss it.

That's funny: that is not the impression I got from the indictment....
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What impression did you get? Are we not reading the same indictment???

Baptist in Richmond · Nov 11, 2005

Originally posted by Enoch:
Thank you Bir for the compliment, I guess I should start my own show.
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Nah, there is an abundance of supply with respect to the conservative talk show format.

A point worth noting…Sorry, I find inconsiderate to sidetrack a thread. Perhaps you could start your own thread concerning your topic of choice if you truly want to discuss it.
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Not exactly: I was inquiring as to whether or not you felt the same way when former President Clinton was indicted. I didn't ask you to go off topic, I simply asked a direct question. If you do not feel compelled to give a direct answer to that direct question, then that is your right.

What impression did you get? Are we not reading the same indictment???
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I sure did: in fact, in my reply to carpro, I even supplied a link to the text of the indictment, didn't I?

Regards,
BiR

Baptist in Richmond · Nov 11, 2005

Originally posted by carpro:
That's the impression I got from the lack of an indictment for doing so.
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Apparently, you missed my question.

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
Sorry, Daisy. No one ever revealed or stated she was a "covert" agent. It was simply revealed she worked for the CIA.
Click to expand...

Are you sure about that?[/QUOTE]Are you sure that this is all that happened? Didn't the despicable Bob Novak then go further and reveal the company for which she worked, revealing her cover?

As it turns out, there is every reason to believe she did not meet the criteria set by the law to be considered a "covert" agent.
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That is not what was stated in the indictment......

Enoch · Nov 11, 2005

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
Not exactly: I was inquiring as to whether or not you felt the same way when former President Clinton was indicted. I didn't ask you to go off topic, I simply asked a direct question. If you do not feel compelled to give a direct answer to that direct question, then that is your right.
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This thread is not about Clinton or Hutchison. Whether your question is direct or not.

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
That's funny: that is not the impression I got from the indictment....
Click to expand...

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
I sure did: in fact, in my reply to carpro, I even supplied a link to the text of the indictment, didn't I?
Click to expand...

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
That is not what was stated in the indictment......
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Please feel free to use the indictment to quote your conclusion.

carpro · Nov 11, 2005

Originally posted by carpro:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Daisy:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by carpro:
...Lt. General Tom McInerney... will join his colleague Maj. General Paul Vallely... on my show... to repeat and expand upon Vallely's memory that Joe Wilson more than once in 2002 in the green room at Fox New Channel in Washington D.C. boasted about his wife the "CIA desk officer." McInerney has the same memory and more, since both he and Vallely were on FNC between 150 and 200 times in 2002 each.
Click to expand...

John Arnato has posted a schedule of Wilson's and Vallely's appearances on Fox News here (linkie). Does either Wilson or Vallely make a habit of hanging out in Fox's green room when he is NOT scheduled to appear (because they evidently didn't appear on the same day in 2002)? Perhaps Arnato is mistaken - what month, week, day does Vallely claim Wilson told him in the green room?

[/QUOTE]I don't know myself, but Wilson seems to think they met in the green room.

In Wilson's email to his attorney (inadvertantly sent to Vallely and Fox) dated 11-5-2005 at 5:11 PM, Wilson stated:

“This is slanderous. I never appeared on tv before at least July 2002 and only saw him maybe twice in the green room at Fox." [/QUOTE]An FOX say this:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0%2C2933%2C175227%2C00.html

This as liberal Websites say they have proof Vallely is lying, saying research service LexisNexis shows Vallely and Wilson never appeared on FOX on the same day. But in fact, Vallely and Wilson appeared on the same day nine times in 2002, and on the same show twice — on September 8 and September 12, when both men appeared within 15 minutes of one another

Looks like Vallely, Wilson and Fox have basically the same story.

LexisNexis is odd source out.

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