Plurality of Elders is the Biblical example

Tiger Fan · Nov 29, 2002

James was the pastor at Jerusalem. Timothy was the pastor at Ephesus. Apollos was the pastor that Paul put in charge at Corinth.
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Chapter and Verse please.

A many-headed monster causes nothing but chaos.
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Would you consider the Trinity to be 'multi-headed'? And what about the 12 apostles? Which 1 of the 12 ruled the other 11?

[ November 29, 2002, 01:46 PM: Message edited by: Tiger Fan ]

DHK · Nov 29, 2002

Originally posted by Tiger Fan:
[qb]

James was the pastor at Jerusalem. Timothy was the pastor at Ephesus. Apollos was the pastor that Paul put in charge at Corinth.

Chapter and Verse please.
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Acts 15:4 And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.
13 And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:
19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
--The Apostles and elders met at the church in Jerusalem. All had their say. In verse 13, James was the final one to speak; he was the pastor. He gave the final decision. His final decision is given in verse 19: "My sentence is..." It was that decision that Paul, Peter, and all the others had to abide by, for James was the Pastor of the church.

A many-headed monster causes nothing but chaos.

Would you consider the Trinity to be 'multi-headed'? And what about the 12 apostles? Which 1 of the 12 ruled the other 11?
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Please don't talk foolishly here. We are not talking of the trinity, a mystery to all of us: three persons in one God. By the way, you have three parts to you also: body, soul, and spirt.
We are speaking of church government, something entirely different. The analogy does not fit.

As I already pointed out to you. The apostles remained in Jerusalem. James acted as their pastor.

8:1 And Saul was consenting unto his death. And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem; and they were all scattered abroad throughout the regions of Judaea and Samaria, except the apostles.

"Except the apostles;" they remained in Jerusalem.
DHK

[ November 29, 2002, 02:23 PM: Message edited by: DHK ]
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rlvaughn · Nov 29, 2002

Originally posted by DHK:
In verse 13, James was the final one to speak; he was the pastor. He gave the final decision. His final decision is given in verse 19: "My sentence is..." It was that decision that Paul, Peter, and all the others had to abide by, for James was the Pastor of the church.
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IMO, such a conclusion is reached only by reading one's presuppostions into the passage, as well as not giving sufficient weight to the official letter sent by the church (vss. 22-29). "Then it pleased the apostles and elders, with the whole church to send chosen men...And they wrote letters by them after this manner: The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren..." Notice "it seemed good unto us...," "We have sent...," etc.

rlvaughn · Nov 29, 2002

Tiger Fan, you may find these discussions of plurality of elders interesting:

Plurality of Elders vs Singularity of Pastors
Church Polity (especially pages 2-4)
Baptist Polity

Tiger Fan · Nov 30, 2002

In verse 13, James was the final one to speak; he was the pastor. He gave the final decision. His final decision is given in verse 19: "My sentence is..." It was that decision that Paul, Peter, and all the others had to abide by, for James was the Pastor of the church.
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That is pure silliness. You are guilty of eisegesis. No where in Acts 15, or any other place in the Bible for that matter, does it say what title or position James held. Acts 15 is a discussion between apostles and elders. No where does it mention apostles, elders and the pastor. You are grasping at straws.

Please see verse 22 of the same chapter: Act 15:22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas: namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren:

No one was obligated to do what James said to do. James, Peter, Paul and Barnabas all spoke concerning the same matter. They all agreed. Just because James was the last one to speak doesn’t make him the pastor. The context of Acts 15 tells you who James was. He was either an apostle or elder or both. He was not THE pastor of the Jerusalem church.

I am still waiting on the chapter and verses for Timothy and Apollos btw.

DHK · Nov 30, 2002

Originally posted by Tiger Fan:

I am still waiting on the chapter and verses for Timothy and Apollos btw.
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1Cor.3:5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?
6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
--Paul was a missionary. He planted churches, then left them in the hand of capable pastors. That was his job. He "planted" the church at Corinth. He put Apollos in charge of it after him. Thus in verse 6, it says that "Apollos watered; but God gave the increase." This was part of the cause of the divisions mentioned in verse five. Some of the carnal Christians didn't want to do things Apollos's way. They didn't think that he was doing things exactly the same way that Paul was--something that always happens when you have a change of pastors in the church.

Titus 1:5 For this cause left I thee in Crete, that thou shouldest set in order the things that are wanting, and ordain elders in every city, as I had appointed thee:
--Titus was the pastor in Crete.

2 Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord.
3 As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine,
--Paul besought Timothy to abide at Ephesus. He was in charge. He was to charge some that they teach no other doctrine. This was a pastoral epistle.
DHK
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