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Preacher supports gay marriage!

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by The Scribe, Jan 20, 2008.

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  1. rbell

    rbell Active Member

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    Theology's really quite easy...when you get to define all the terms yourself.:saint: :thumbs:
     
  2. standingfirminChrist

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    actually, ear peircing was an act of love of a slave for his or her master who has released him from slavery. If the slave chose to stay, he had his ear pierced through as a sign of that loyalty to the master.

    Exodus 21:5-6 And if the servant shall plainly say, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free: Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him for ever.

    Question, when one pierces one's ear, what is the motive? To wear jewelry to make one look more attractive? That is vanity.

    or is it a sign of loyalty to a master? and if a sign of loyalty, which master?
     
  3. standingfirminChrist

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    seems like some want to redefine what the word defile means.
     
  4. Joe

    Joe New Member

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    Leviticus 19:28 Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I [am] the Lord.


    Actually, it appears if you get piercings for the dead, then it is disallowed.
     
  5. rbell

    rbell Active Member

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    So, context works for piercings, but not tattooes?

    My assertion is that it's for both...

    My issue with the Scribe is, he thinks it's OK for women to get their ears pierced...which goes against the very Scriptural interpretation he's using in talking with me....
     
  6. Joe

    Joe New Member

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    To be safe, it would probably be best not to do either one. They are lumped together in this verse. Though a tiny piercing is probably not what the lord would call a cutting. You almost need a microscope to see it.

    Getting your ears pierced is a common custom for women in our society so it won't hinder any witnessing attempts if it is shown.
     
  7. rbell

    rbell Active Member

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    [devils advocate]

    But I thought Scripture was the determinant...a "little piercing"--isn't that like a "white lie?"

    And are we now letting whether or not a piercing or tattoo hinders a witnessing attempt be the determinant? I can show you folks that are more likely to listen to someone with a tattoo...not less. Does that make it OK?

    [/devils advocate]

    (I just love pointing out little inconsistencies! :saint: :laugh: )
     
  8. The Scribe

    The Scribe New Member

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    :thumbs:

    Women getting their ears pierced is fine it will not hinder nor distract.

    A male piercing would.
     
  9. rbell

    rbell Active Member

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    a few pages ago you were quoting Scripture.

    Now, it seems, we're not bringing Scripture into it....

    Which is it? Yes or no? Why is it OK when you quoted Leviticus, which (your interpretation of it) says it's not?

    Why can girls get pierced but not guys?

    Sorry...inconsistencies still abound.

    Ya'll fight. I'm tired. :wavey:
     
  10. The Scribe

    The Scribe New Member

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    The scripture says cuttings or markings. A small piercing in a woman's ear is fine. She needs to wear modest jewelry

    No one looks twice at a woman when she gets her ears pierced and they shouldn't.

    It's different when a guy gets his ears, nose, eyebrow, lip and so on pierced. It will hinder them, especially if they are a preacher.

    Some piercing's are linked to homosexuality. [Personal attack removed]
     
    #110 The Scribe, Jan 21, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 21, 2008
  11. Joe

    Joe New Member

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    No it's not the determinant. To be honest, the health and safety risks also bother me.

    Picture this:

    I go to a tattoo parlour and let some fat guy named Bubba who hasn't bathed in a week and reeks of cigarette smoke pull out a needle, and start plowing into my skin using some machine which doesn't feel too pleasurable, and sounds like a drill from my dentists office. A few bugs, lice maybe, jump on my body while sitting in that grubby chair that some skank did some bad act on with another guy right before I got there. Bubba says to me, "So what do you do for fun?" and we all know what that means. Now I have double the chances of getting AIDS if he cuts himself while doing my tattoo. Oh, and the other diseases....Despite my reservations, he continues to tell me violent stories which are better than the one's he started with. He finishes, I finally pay in cash. Then a drunk verbally assults me while walking to my car ( because they always stick those tattoo parlours near a liquor store or bar, along with possibly a check cashing business or lingere store a few doors down) I get to my car to see a criminal has broken my window, gotten into the glove compartment and stole my cell phone and jacket. A teenager then interrupts me to ask me to buy him beer, someone tries to sell me drugs, then a prostitute hits on me. I finally get inside and wonder if the bugs are going to infect my car, if I should throw away my pants, and I need to get to the closest business where I can wash my hands.

    OR another scinereo- Insert a female into the equasion, her name is Bubba :eek:

    This may be an exaggeration, but not by much :laugh: I wasn't born yesterday
     
    #111 Joe, Jan 21, 2008
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  12. ReCreated

    ReCreated New Member

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    Tattoo's? Piercing's? Gay Marriage?

    I'd like to start by stating this..I am against gay marriage.

    But one cannot say that being gay has anything to do with piercing's or tattoo's

    When I first met some of my strong brothers and sisters in christ one of the big issues that inhibited our spiritual bond was my piercings and 1 tattoo.

    Why are we so close now? I told them my convictions on the subject.

    Yes, Leviticus 19:28 may condemn tattoos and piercings, but the chapter also condemns trimming beards and cutting hair. If scruffy bikers with tattoos are condemned, then so are clean-shaven businessmen (not to mention anyone who has a ham sandwich).

    Piercings and tattoos were not allowed under the law of Moses, hair and beards were not allowed to be cut.

    Fortunately, we now live under grace, not the law of Moses.


    After the Resurrection of Christ living by the law was meant to stop

    We are saved by Gods grace not by following Laws
    God himself instills in each believer the desire to worship and serve him.
    Each believer has their own personal convictions and while they are similar to other believers because God is unchanging they are still unique and individual.

    So When are piercings and tattoos wrong?

    when they interfere in our daily worship and servitude
    and when they become our golden calf

    Why do I choose to keep my earrings in?

    1. God has not convicted me in any way shape or form to remove them.
    2. God has allowed me to witness to people through conversations started by my earrings.
    3. The bible clearly states that ear piercings were a mark of servitude, I serve my savior daily.
    4. They are a constant reminder of the lowest point of my spiritual life
    5. They are a constant remembrance of how much Gods Caused me to grow.

    Will I take them out?

    YES

    When?

    1. When God convicts me to do so.
    2. When my spiritual growth has reached a point when I am ready to learn to lead others in the Christian life "youth pastor/preacher"

    How will I deal with others piercings after mine are gone?

    I will accept the fact that they made that choice. I will not be a stumbling block. I will wait for God to give them their own conviction to remove them if that time ever comes.
     
  13. standingfirminChrist

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    So you don't think peircings are defiling the body?
     
  14. ReCreated

    ReCreated New Member

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    after thought

    Alot of the arguments im sorry debates posted atacks bakers liberal standpoint and proper christian appearance

    While i dont agree with the man.
    The defining of proper christian appearance is legalistic in itself.

    How can their be proper christian appearance when everyones relationship with the almighty is a personal experience

    Before the resurection of Christ the hebrew law was set in place as a redeeming of sin, as was sacrifice.

    now after the resurection we no longer need to sacrifice, live by a guideline, or confess to a priest. now we have the holy spirit to guide us and have the opportunity to have a personal relationship with God.

    their is no way a person can say that my relationship with God has to be the same as theirs.

    And no offence but my relationship with God has been so much more fullfilling then the cardboard cut out christianity i was taught as a child. since throwing away The "rules" of proper chistians i have grown to learn i dont need man to tell me how to be a christian when the Bible God's spoken word can tell me and Gods still small voice in my prayers tells me. because of this I know my God lives beause he speaks to me every day. so how do i define Gods still small voice from the attacks of satan? the still small voice never contradicts my bible.

    My God loves me no matter what i do because i am saved by his grace i show my love for him and prove my faith by living for him daily not living to please men
     
  15. ReCreated

    ReCreated New Member

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    peircings are defiling the body?

    how can they defile the body when we are already defiled by the fall of adam our bodys are unclean from the day we are born after we accept christ into our lives and eventually go to be with our lord we are given a new body a clean sinless body the way God intended us.

    in the book of exodus the tabernacle was the physical manifestation of the temple of God that is our bodies today built with the most valuble materials and decorated with the most beautifull of metals and other fine items of the day.

    piercings are a mark of beauty to the common society today cant we decorate the temple of God?

    also the bible clearly accepts the piercing of ears as an act of love towards ones master a bonding of eternal servitude
    if you read into my first post further you will see the statement (I serve my savior daily.)
     
    #115 ReCreated, Jan 21, 2008
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  16. standingfirminChrist

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    You are in err. You are living to please yourself by your piercings.

    The Word of God states that if any man defile the temple of God, him will God destroy.

    You reject that warning and state with a rebellious spirit that piercings were forbidden in the Old Testament but not in the New Testament.

    Well my friend, the verse I just quoted is not found in the Old Testament, but in the New.

    1 Corinthians 3:17.

    Our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit. They do not belong to us, but to God. He paid for them, we did not.

    It is the world that cuts themselves and pierces themselves in order to appease their gods. Just as the prophets of baal cut themselves in the book of the Kings, men are cutting themselves today to appease their gods. Only their gods are their bellies. The satisfying of the flesh.

    Piercing is defiling that body that God entrusted man with. And man is not being a faithful steward.

    If one wants to be accepted of God, one cannot love the things of the world. The Bible is clear on this

    Love not the world, neither the things of the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in Him.

    We cannot be pleasing to God when we are in rebellion to His Word. His Word forbids the defiling of the body.
     
  17. standingfirminChrist

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    If it were not possible to defile the body, Paul would not have written in the Epistle to the Church of Corinth not to defile it.

    We must remember, the Word of God was written under inspiration of the Holy Spirit. So Paul's Epistle was inspiried of God. The warning not to defile the body was of God, not at the fall of Adam, but after the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ.

    Yes, it is possible to defile the body.
     
  18. ReCreated

    ReCreated New Member

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    First off my bible was not inspired by God. My bible is the direct Spoken Word of God. when it comes to Defining the word Defile I've left it to the Holy Spirit to tell me what is defiling my body. His answer was anything that inhibits the capability to witness to the unbeliver my earings have not done this in anyway. if anything they've occasionaly sparked the conversation that allowed me to tell them that God wanted them just as they are.

    If their is one thing i've learned in my life christians need to be a help not a stumbling block, let go and let God, when i became a christian my life was changed by God not by some man that thought he new what was right

    and no i dont wear earings to please myself 90% of the time i dont even notice they are there but they are who i am and every day God changes who i am some day God may changes my ears but for now i know this God loves me no matter what their is no sin i can commit that he cannot forgive me for and when he tells me peircings are a sin he will forgive me and i will take them out. but God has never told me they are wrong.
     
  19. standingfirminChrist

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    If your Bible is not inspired by God, your Bible is not the Word of God and you are being deceived by a lying spirit.
     
  20. ReCreated

    ReCreated New Member

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    I'm Sorry but im sure my bible is the same as your's

    But my belief is that my bible is God's word not man's work inspired by God.

    read John 1:1
    In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
     
    #120 ReCreated, Jan 21, 2008
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