1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Promoting the SBC

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Salty, Dec 11, 2017.

  1. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2003
    Messages:
    25,097
    Likes Received:
    571
    Faith:
    Baptist
    IN another Thread JonC stated "the average member does not care about the SBC except in giving to missions".

    So how much emphasis should a church put on the fellowship of the SBC (or any other Baptist denomination)
    Granted, one of the major points is the missions program - but should we encourage our members to attend the local association, State and even national meetings,
    Should we have classes on the history of the SBC
    Should we.......

    Open for discussion.


    Disclaimer - I use the word "denomination" in a loose way - As with all Baptists - our "Headquarters" exercises no control over us.
     
  2. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,685
    Likes Received:
    376
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes!

    Heck yes!

    That's a shame, and it's why the SBC is a million things to a million people. It's so inconsistent, it can't be defined. (I say that as a fan of the SBC). Some hierarchical structure is a good thing.

    In the casting off all things Rome, the baby got thrown out with the bathwater on more than one occasion.
     
  3. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2003
    Messages:
    25,097
    Likes Received:
    571
    Faith:
    Baptist
    In essence there is a hierarchy - but all it can do is recommend - as every local church is autonomous. .
     
  4. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    43,808
    Likes Received:
    1,769
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The SBC is not a denomination it is a cooperative. If a church is going to fund mission by being part of the SBC they should also be a part of conventions and meetings. To do otherwise is irresponsible and lazy.
     
  5. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2011
    Messages:
    7,223
    Likes Received:
    509
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The convention came first not the cooperative programed giving.

    One can be a thriving member of the SBC and not give a dime in support of the cooperative program.

    The early church had no cooperative program that allied churches together, but each gave as they deemed appropriate, and some sent support back to the founding church in Jerusalem.
     
  6. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    43,808
    Likes Received:
    1,769
    Faith:
    Baptist
    First there is a, minimum of 250 that must be given. Second we are not a denomination, we are a cooperative.
     
  7. JonC

    JonC Lifelong Disciple
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    12,437
    Likes Received:
    1,012
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I didn't think about it at the time, but it is worth mentioning that we do enjoy the fellowship of local (county) Baptist association.
     
  8. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2011
    Messages:
    7,223
    Likes Received:
    509
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I agree.
    None.

    The convention is to serve the local assembly, not the other way around.

    Why?

    It is a waste of money and time.

    If at the local level, pastors desire to support each other, that is good.

    If at the local level, cooperating churches support each other in a program, that is good.

    But, there is no need for the local assembly to become enamored with the bureaucratic impulses of the national and state levels.

    Back in the day, the greater amount of delegates to the convention(s) were there for show and tell, wanting to hobnob with who they considered important.

    I doubt that there is much different in this time.
     
  9. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    7,595
    Likes Received:
    243
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The $250 dollar thing is no longer true. The SBC Constitution was amended recently, and now each church can send two messengers for any amount contributed to the Cooperative Program, Executive Committee, or Entities. A third, fourth, fifth, etc. messenger can be sent to the Convention for every $6,000 contribution or full percent of the church's undesignated receipts sent through those three channels, up to a maximum of a dozen messengers per church.

    Southern Baptist Convention > Constitution
     
  10. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2011
    Messages:
    7,223
    Likes Received:
    509
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The name at the national level is Southern Baptist Convention.

    The name at the state level is Southern Baptist Convention of (state).

    The name of the local level is often a name of a region, such as North >>> Association of Southern Baptists.

    But not any of the organization is not a cooperative, with the exception of local groupings who cooperate together for a unified goal.

    Perhaps you are misled in the thinking that distinguishes conventions from cooperatives.

    In a convention, the stake holders (individual assemblies) actually have no ownership authority such as cooperatives do.

    Typically, conventions are executive committee controlled with obligatory reporting to a "board" which has no ability to change or modify the executive committee direction other then by advisement and member replacement. No contributing member has authority over that board nor over the executive committee.

    Cooperatives have each member a stakeholder owner and in some manner authority in the operation and decision making. Cooperatives are like confederations, in which each member has authority and can directly move to change the rules to live. Depending on the establishment they may be ruled by majority or a percentage of the whole (like the U. S. House operates).

    An example is to look at the typical political setup. No state has power or authority over the convention (either democrat or republican) but send delegates who may appeal to the various committees to change, or they may have an uprising in which the convention business must conform.

    Back in the day, the "cooperative" thinking was really being pushed, because the programed approach to giving was a significant driving force in the influence of the convention, and some desired to change the direction (either for the good or the worse depending on the viewpoint).

    However, the convention was not then, nor formed as, nor held to this day as a cooperative.
     
  11. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    Messages:
    2,685
    Likes Received:
    376
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The there is no hierarchy.

    I was a member of an SBC which had some infighting, and Mark Dever had to fly in to help resolve it. He didn't resolve it, BTW, but he did attempt to act as a pope. Had the SBC had some way of dealing with this, as the PCA does, there might have been a resolution which would have prevented one of the best preachers in the SBC to leave the church, which quickly went back to the liberals.
     
  12. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    43,808
    Likes Received:
    1,769
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Have you ever heard of "CP" giving? Go to erlc.com and look up the article "5 facts about cooperative program.
     
  13. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    43,808
    Likes Received:
    1,769
    Faith:
    Baptist
    State and local associations still enforce it
     
  14. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2011
    Messages:
    7,223
    Likes Received:
    509
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Again,

    The convention existed prior to the cooperative program

    The convention does not exist because of the CP, rather the opposite.
     
  15. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    43,808
    Likes Received:
    1,769
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Again the southern baptist convention is a cooperative. Always has been always will be.
     
  16. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2001
    Messages:
    11,289
    Likes Received:
    671
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No, the Cooperative Program kept together disparate views for decades. The SBC ignored the divides within the convention for the sake of the CP. You can be a Landmarker or a liberal; the important thing is to support the CP.

    That is no longer true. Churches are going their own ways; they feel free to redistribute their spending as they see fit.
     
  17. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2011
    Messages:
    7,223
    Likes Received:
    509
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The SBC was FIRST!

    It was formed so that a cooperative programed approach could be taken to the mission emphasis.

    The cooperative program RESULTED in the formation of the SBC.

    The cooperative program did not form the SBC.

    The Convention was NEVER a coop.

    Such thinking was supposedly refuted back in the 60's.

    But apparently someone has been misinformed.

    Coops are OWNED by the individual members, who express direct CONTROL over the coop.

    Conventions are NOT controlled nor owned by the individual member (groups), but invest control into executive committees who report back annually to the convention giving broad scope reports and at rare times more detailed analysis.

    The Convention may ONLY influence the committees by suggesting and recommending, and at times may remove a committee member. But the convention members do not control the SBC - they have no right to ownership in contrast to coops.

    The members of the SBC may cooperate together for any emphasis of their own choosing, but such takes place outside of the executive committee authority to regulate.

    The executive committee make all legal and financial decisions related to the SBC.
     
  18. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    43,808
    Likes Received:
    1,769
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Go to erlc.com and look up the article "5 facts about cooperative program.
     
  19. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2014
    Messages:
    5,104
    Likes Received:
    738
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I fell out with the SBC when they rewarded the bad behavior of the race pimps at the last convention,
     
  20. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    12,806
    Likes Received:
    933
    Faith:
    Baptist
    ...member, this is merica....
     
Loading...