1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Rob Bell book 'Love Wins' stirs controversy, denies core Christian beliefs

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by mandym, Dec 22, 2011.

  1. glfredrick

    glfredrick New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2010
    Messages:
    4,996
    Likes Received:
    2
    Yes, but that is not the sum of the salvific doctrine.

    In discussions of this nature the debate sometimes turns to an examination of the reasons for the atonement (or even if there was an actual atonement) and many of the historical positions or reasons for the atonement come to the fore.

    Ransom Theory
    Penal Substitution Theory
    Example Theory
    Christus Victor Theory
    Satisfaction Theory
    Moral Theory
    Acceptance Theory
    The Narrative Theory

    And probably a few others that I have not remembered right now.

    Each person stands on one particular theory as THE theory that explains the atonement when in fact, virtually all of the theories are required to explain the full extent of the atonement. It was/is all for all, but not in a universalistic sense, rather that it absolutely and utterly satisfied all the demands of God, legal, spiritual, moral, physical, and in any other potential or actual needed way.
     
  2. JesusFan

    JesusFan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2011
    Messages:
    8,913
    Likes Received:
    240
    Salvation would be the work of God to redeem us, NOT based upon my behaviour and good works, but in spite of them!

    So Bell is found wanting once again!
     
  3. nodak

    nodak Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,269
    Likes Received:
    16
    "Salvation would be the work of God to redeem us, NOT based on my behavior and good works, but in spite of them."

    THAT is the point of Bell's book. God saves whom God saves.

    God chooses whom God chooses--not those that choose Him.
     
  4. JesusFan

    JesusFan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2011
    Messages:
    8,913
    Likes Received:
    240
    bell out barths Karl barth!
    barth provided for all to be saved by the atonement of Christ, election in Him, but refused to go to Universalism...

    Bell ran head long into heresy 101!
     
  5. glfredrick

    glfredrick New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2010
    Messages:
    4,996
    Likes Received:
    2
    In case none of you saw it over the weekend, Bell resigned from Mars Hill. Here is his letter of resgination -- windy, wordy, creative == yes, but heretical still.

    http://www.dennyburk.com/rob-bell-resigns-from-mars-hill/

    http://www.toddrhoades.com/rob-bell...blog+(Todd+Rhoades)&utm_content=Google+Reader

    N.T. Wright (who mostly comes from Bell's perspective and who leads the charge on the "New Perspective on Paul") has this to say:

    http://trevinwax.com/2011/05/24/n-t-wright-on-rob-bell-and-the-reality-of-hell/
     
  6. JesusFan

    JesusFan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2011
    Messages:
    8,913
    Likes Received:
    240
    Reading that thread that you linked us to....

    is NT Wright supporting the general premise of bell work then or not, as hard to see just exactly where Wright is coming from on this!
     
  7. glfredrick

    glfredrick New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2010
    Messages:
    4,996
    Likes Received:
    2
    Nature of the game... People with varying views try to nuance their words so as to appear orthodox and mainstream until they are discovered or pressed to write clearly.

    Wright has long been right alongside Bell in most of what he has written, but doesn't want to go down with Bell's ship, so he distances himself with a few caveats. Of course, Bell doesn't think that he is going down with the ship either. He actually thinks that he is on to something tangible that might reconcile some of the historical issues in Christianity, problem of evil, problem of the will versus God's sovereignty, etc. Of course, he will be found wanting, for in so doing he has already dismissed the God of the Bible as has Wright. That God is equal in His attributes, including judgment. He is not "just" love and relationship or mercy and grace. He can and will judge and discipline, especially His own (not so much those already or yet lost in condemnation -- they are judged already).
     
  8. nodak

    nodak Active Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,269
    Likes Received:
    16
    I would say much of what Bell teaches is heresy.

    Just that it isn't NEW heresy.

    And the one's who profit from writing books against what he teaches are strangly silent about those who agree with Bell.

    Which smells like marketing ploy to me.

    No intention to read any more Bell, or buy any of his books.

    But no intention to read or buy any of his enemies "anti-Bell" books unless they are scholarly books that attack his teachings--not the person--since many others teach the same stuff he does, without attack.

    Not sure I understand how he out Barth's Barth.

    I will say, being monergistic, yes, God saves whomever God chooses to save.

    I disagree with Bell that someone can be beyond the ability to believe due to being socialized in another culture and religion.

    Good grief--wasn't Saul/Paul? Look what God did to and with him!
     
Loading...