Romans 2:1-15

The subject defined in Romans 2:1-5 is "O man whosoever thou (you) art" thus "you" has its antecedent in "O Man whosoever" and indeed the repetition of "o man" is found in verse 3 again.

Who is this "man"? It is by description in verses 1-5 the kind of man who THINKS he can escape the judgement he knows will come in spite of surpressing the light of nature and conscience given him. He is the unregenerate gentile kind of man of Romans 1:18-32 and in which verse 32 states clearly "they" know the judgement of God but do it any way because they THINK they can get away with it. What we have in Romans 1:18-32 is GENERIC ABSTRACT teaching "they." What we have in Romans 2:1-5 is CONCRETE ABSTRACT application to "O man whosoever" thinketh as previously described.

It is this kind of (unregenerate Gentile who suppresses the truth) man that the rules of justice are set forth in Romans 2:6-15 that demonstrate what he "THINKETH" simply won't happen.

In Romans 2:16-27 we have another kind of ABSTRACT CONRETE application to another kind of man who THINKS the very same way because this kind of man has been given special revelation and knows the law.

However, in Romans 2:28-29 the only kind of man who is safe from judgement is the kind whose INWARD condition reveals a REGENERATE kind of man. In application to his readers, self-examination by both Gentile members and Jewish members in regard to how they THINK in this matter and what classification do they fall under (1) Characteristics of the Unregenerate Gentile who thinks they can escape judgement when supressing the truth; (2) Characteristics of the Unregenerate Jew who thinks they can escape judgement based upon their knowledge and who they are by physical birth; (3) Characteristic of the regenerate man.

 

The wording of Romans 2:2-5 makes your application of the phrase "goodness of God leads you to repentance" impossible. Repentance is a change of mind, and the mind being expressed in this context is that this person "THINKETH" they can escape the judgement of God "And thinkest thou this, O man..... that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?." Therefore gospel repentance has nothing to do with this text as the next argument also demonstrates.


Second, the "goodness of God" defined in this context is the delay of God in bringing judgement upon this person or the "longsuffering" and "patience" of God not the presentation of the gospel.

Third, Paul gives only one kind of response for this kind of person to the "goodness of God and it is continuance in unrepentance that leads to further hardening "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;"

Fourth, all the verbs used to describe this person are found in the present tense which show these are this person continuous unchanging characteristic actions.

Finally, when all these facts are taken in account together, Paul is addressing any person hearing this reading that fits the characteristics previously described in Romans 1:18-32 - the unregenerate gentile just as Romans 2:16-27 addresses any unregenerate Jew that fits such characteristics among the hearing audiance. Hence, there is no contrast of good versus bad persons being considered in verses 1-5 or 16-27but only unregenerate persons.

Furthermore, there is no contradiction between elective grace and no respect of persons by God in judgement. All sinners alike deserve judgement but no sinner deserves or can demand grace. You are the one that believes election is based upon forseen action by some but not others. Hence, God is a respector of persons in your election scheme. In the Biblical scheme election is purely "of grace" (Rom. 9:11, 17; 11:5-6, 7-8) whether it is applied to Israel or to gentiles (Rom. 9:24).

 

I said this before but the last words of verse 5 "righteous judgment" introduces the subject for why Paul penned verses 6-15 and placed it (vv. 6-15) right between gentile religous hypocrits who believed they would escape judgement (vv. 1-5) and Jewish religious hypocrits who believed they will escape judgement (vv. 16-27).

This text (vv. 6-15) is not placed between a description of lost and saved before or after.

However, the term "righteous" judgement introduces verses 6-15.

Now, here is where you, Bob and I come to our point of disagreement.

You and Bob argue that verses 6-15 are descriptive of actual applications in the last day of judgement to saved and lost. You base that argument upon the consequences that are prescibed to those who continue in law keeping in verses 6-7 in contrast to those who do not and therefore draw the conclusion that law keeping is the basis for final justification before God. I think I have fairly stated your position.

However, my position and interpretation is that Paul is directly addressing self righteous hypocrits who believe they will escape the judgement of God based upon their own perception of righteousness (vv. 1-5; 16-27). It is this perceived "righteousness" in regard to their own works and personal condition that Paul is contrasting with what is really the "righteousness" demanded by the law of God that Paul is addressing in ABSTRACT application in verses 6-15.

In other words, Paul is saying, if you think you will escape the judgement of God based upon your OWN RIGHTEOUS WORKS then let me fill you in on what God's standard of righteousness in regard to YOUR WORKS is all about.

1. IF your works characterize what God's law demands then you get a just reward

2. IF your works characterize what God's law condemns then you get a just reward

3. God will not judge you by what you don't know but by what light you have been given.

4. God will not judge you based upon who you are

5. God will not judge you righteous by merely what you say but by what the law demands to really keep it.

6. God will not judge you rightous by mere external conformity to the Law.

It is on this basis of righteousness by works that Paul concludes in Romans 3:9-21 there is NONE THAT DOETH GOOD, NO, NOT ONE and that the WHOLE WORLD, and EVERY MOUTH is condemned by God's standard of works and that NO FLESH can be justified on the basis of personal performance while they are unregenerate (Rom. 1:18-3:18) or after they are regenerated (Rom. 4:1-21).

 

The following statement is the crux of your difference of interpretation:

The fact that some will indeed get eternal life based on good works (as per 2:6-7) does not change the fact that others will get wrath.

What I believe you fail to perceive is that Paul is responding only to their PERCEPTION that good works = their perceived righteousness - will escape judgement under God's Law. Paul is addressing their perception according to what the reality of how the law of God will justly deal with anyone coming before God on this basis as they plan on doing. If they perceive that works of righteousness will vindicate them then here is the FAIR and JUST principles by which God's Law is applied to works both good and bad.

There is no declaration here that truly justified people HAVE THIS PERCEPTION or will ever FACTUALLY come before God according to this basis. Paul is dealing with the perception of the unregenerate man whose only basis to escape judgement is HIS OWN WORKS.

By contrast in the context of justified people Paul systematically repudiates that this is either their perception or factual in their case (Rom. 4).

 

Correcting Two Misconceptions

Romans 2:1-29 corrects two misconceptions held by unregenerate gentiles and Jews.

1. Some Gentiles THOUGHT since they did not do some or all the bad things listed in Roman 1:21-32 they could escape judgement because they did better or by their good works - Romans 2:1-5

2. Some Jews THOUGHT since they were given the law that this gave them an advantage at judgement over the gentiles and particularly circumcision - Romans 2:11-29

Paul's argument is very simple. Doing better is not good enough but it must be as good as the law demands. Having the law profits you nothing unless you keep the law according to its demands. Having circumcision gives no advantaage unless you keep all the law.

Judgement day will reveal the standard demanded by the law to be righteous by good works and it is the same standard James gives. To fail in "one point" is to fail all points and therefore to keep the law means that you never fail in "one point" but keep all points.

He is not arguing that either the gentile or Jew actually can or do keep either law given to each of them as that is a misconception on their part which judgement day will reveal and his conclusion in Romans 3:9-21 will declare.

The Gentile does not keep the law written on their conscience any better than the Jew keeps the law written on stone. Paul argues with the jews that if they did keep the law written on their conscience they would be more righteous than the Jew with all his law and circumcision. However, Paul is not arguing the gentiles actualy do keep the law written on their conscience any better than the Jew keeps the law written on stone.

 

I said that Paul is dealing with those who PERCEIVE wrongly that they will escape judgement based upon their perception that their good works will giving them a passing grade on judgement day.

I base this misperception upon clear and explicit contextual statements:

1. Gentiles who perceive themselves BETTER than those described in Romans 1:18-32:

And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God? - Rom. 2:3

Paul is addressing "o man" who has just read his description of the digression of the gentiles into greater and greater wickedness in Romans 1:21-32 and "judged" (condemned) them but concluded they were better than those. This was a misperception of themselves as well as the demands of law. The law does not have a relative standard of righteousness. If you fail "ONE POINT" you are condemned a "sinner" as much as if you failed TWO, TEN, FIFTY, ONE HUNDRED points because to fail in one is to fail in ALL. This is the basis of their misconception because this is exactly how they perceived themselves in comparison to those in chapter one as they perceived the standard of the law to be RELATIVE. Hence, since they were not AS BAD they beleived they would escape the judgement of the law.

2. The Jews had the very same misconception of themselves due to the very same misconception of what it means to keep the law. The law does not have a RELATIVE standard where some who fail only one or two points will escape judgement as sinners over those who fail three or hundred points.

(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified..... Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God,
18 And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law;
19 And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness,
20 An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.
21 Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself? thou that preachest a man should not steal, dost thou steal?
22 Thou that sayest a man should not commit adultery, dost thou commit adultery? thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege?
23 Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?
24 For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written.
.

Paul could use the present tense "is" in verse 24 and draw this conclusion because the law does not have a RELATIVE standard of righteousness but an ABSOLUTE standard.

3. This Misperception of themselves was based upon their Misconception of the Law's standard. Paul is addressing those who believe they can come before God and be justified according to this misconception of themselves due to misconception of the Law's standard of judgement and that is precisely why he begins the introduction of judgement by the Law of God with the words "righteous judgment" at the end of verse 5.

Your own interpretation of the Law of God is precisely this same misconception that there is a RELATIVE standard used by the Law so that those whose good works out weigh their bad works will be ultimately justified before God.

This is not Paul's view of the Law of God. Paul sees no RELATIVE standard of righteousness but an ABSOLUTE standard of righteousness and that is why he draws the EXACT OPPOSITE conclusion to judgement by law than you do (Rom. 3:9-21).

4. This is why Romans 2:6-10 is not found in the context of anyone who perceives themselves as justified by faith but in a context of those who perceive themselves justified by a RELATIVE standard of works. Those who perceive themselves justified by faith alone DO NOT COME INTO ANY FUTURE JUDGEMENT in regard to entrance into heaven versus hell (Jn. 5:24 - "shall not come into condemnation, but is passed from death to life"). They already have "peace with God" (Rom. 5:1) and a completed standing of "grace" (Rom. 5:2).

Hence, the bottom line is that the misconception of these gentiles as stated clearly in Romans 2:3 and the misconception of these Jews in Romans 2:11,17-24 is the misconception of themselves based upon the misconception of the Law's standard which they assumed was RELATIVE and this is also your own misconception. Judgement day for all who come before God on the basis of these misconceptions will be a shocking surprise to see that the only standard of righteousness of God is ABSOLUTE not relative. Those who are justified by faith in Christ's ABSOLUTE righteousness will be the only ones who pass this judgement because it is HIS WORKS not theirs that God will judge.

 

And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God? - Rom. 2:3

We have all agreed on this forum that Paul is addressing a hypocrit in verses 1-5.

Now, let us see what this hypocrisy is. Would you agree with me that in verse 3 above that the hypocrisy has to do with wrong thinking? "And THINKETH THOU THIS"???

Also, would it be wrong thinking toward those Paul previously described in Romans 1:22-32? "them that do such things"? What things? It has to be things they can be condemned for and the only things Paul has listed that have been condemned are those things listed in Romans 1:22-32.

Now, what is the nature of their wrong THINKING? They are joining Paul in condemning them when they are guilty of doing the very same things and yet they feel they will escape judgement while those in Romans 1:22-32 will not escape judgment but are justly condemned. "O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same"

Now, what kind of thinking can condemn others for doing those things listed in Romans 1:22-32 but feel justified they will "escape" judgement when they are guilty of doing the same things? The only kind of thinking that can come to such a conclusion is the kind that thinks COMPARATIVELY and believes they are not AS BAD. This is exactly the kind of thinking by the Jews in Romans 2:17-24. It is the kind of thinking that believes the judgement of God works on a RELATIVE scale of righteousness instead of an ABSOLUTE scale of righteousness.
This is precisely why verse 5 concludes with this description of God's coming "righteous" judgement.
All those who come before God with this kind of WRONG THINKING will be judged RIGHTEOUSLY "according to their works" and the law does not judge RELATIVELY but ABSOLUTELY and that is why it requires only violation of the law in "ONE" point to be guilty of ALL the law. This is why Jesus could say "there is none good but one and that is God."

The law of conscience will condemn you to death as a sinner if you violate it in ONE point just as much as the law of Moses will condemn you to death as a sinner if you violate but ONE point.

Now gentleman, this is precisely why your exposition and conclusion of this passage is directly OPPOSITE to Paul's conclusion in Romans 3:9-21 because you have the same misconception of those Paul is addressing in chapter 2

 

The text says "WHOSOVER THOU ART" and you want to limit it to a special restricted class!

He is talking to ANYONE who fits this description whether they are members or non-members, listeners, readers, present or not present. He is talking about EVERYBODY who fits this description.

The only kind of person that can condemn those in Romans 1:18-32 and yet are guilty of doing the same things is a person who "THINKETH" that God's Law judges on a SLIDING SCALE and they will escape judgment because they perceive themselves on the UPPER SIDE of that scale.

God has no SLIDING SCALE as James speaking to professed saved people (JAMES 2:10) denies any sliding scale for BELIEVERS.

This is precisely why the last words of Romans 2:5 introduce the judgement of God in regard to those who come before him with that kind of THINKING to inform them that God's judgment will be "RIGHTEOUS" as God defines it not according to their MISCONCEPTION that cause them to THINK they will escape the judgement of God.

BTW you fit this description

 

There is no imagination required. Paul explicity states their thinking is wrong - "thinketh thou" - v. 3. They agree with Paul that those in Romans 1:18-32 are to be condemned. The problem is that they are guilt of the same things but in their mind they believe they will escape judgement. How is it possible to agree that such should be condemned and yet think that you can escape judgement if you do the same things?

The answer is exactly the same in regard to the Jew in verses 17-24. He also judges the gentiles as worthy of condemnation but believes he shall escape judgement even when he is guilty of violating exactly what he teaches others. How can he believe that?

Those in Romans 1:18-32 do not believe they will escape judgement - v. 32

Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

Those in Romans 2:1-5 and 2:17-24 claim to be MORE RIGHTEOUS and that is the basis for their hypocrisy as well as their belief they will escape judgement, but those in Romans 1:32 do not claim to be righteous at all nor claim to escape the judgement of God.

This assumption is based on the belief that judgement will be on a SLIDING SCALE and that is exactly what you believe Bob. Romans 2:3 is directly addressed to Bob.

 

Your response makes perfect nonsense. I never said that those condemned in Romans 2:18-29 are those approved in Romans 2:1-5; 17-24 - they are all condemned in the judgement in Romans 2:6-15. Those in Romans 1:1-17 "shall not come into condemnation but is passed from death unto life" (Jn. 5:24; Rom. 5:1-2; 8:28-39).

Those in Romans 1:1-17 are not described until Romans 3:21-8:39.

Romans 1:18-3:8 is to prove why the gospel needs to be preached to the outright ungodly (1:18-32) and to the self-righteous who believe they can escape judgement because they see themselves better than others and therefore assume they will escape a SLIDING SCALE judgement (Rom. 2:1-29).

It is clear and simple and Paul's conclusion in Romans 3:9 takes the reader back to the introduction of wrath against the Gentile (Rom. 1:18) to his judgement in Romans 2:5-11) and then proceeds to condemn the Jew on the same basis (Rom. 2:12-3:8).

Any conclusion of this designated and ear marked section by Paul in Romans 3:9 that draws a different conclusion than Paul in Romans 3:10-21 is based upon the very same problem by the very same type of self-righteous people described in Romans 2.