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Featured Sanctification not inclusive of Justification

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by The Biblicist, May 19, 2012.

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  1. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    Readers, take note that SBM is admitting he cannot respond to the scriptures presented in an exegetical contextual fashion.

    God was justifying the ungodly but not apart from believing as both terms are found in the PRESENT tense. So it is justification "by faith" and "without works" which again condemns your theories.
     
    #81 The Biblicist, May 23, 2012
  2. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    There is no way in the world, that any of God's Elect were ever in a state of condemnation, for that is the clear Truth of Rom 8:33-34

    33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

    34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

    Now when did God lay any Charge to His Elect ? When did He condemneth them ? Nor ever !

    Faith had nothing to with it, neither did New Birth, only as stated in vs 34 " it is Christ that died and risen, and maketh intercession, simply the work of Christ ! Add anything to that is a false Gospel !
     
    #82 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  3. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    God Justifies the Ungodly !

    the bib

    This is handling the word of God deceitfully, for the scripture plainly says that Believeth on Him that Justieth the Ungodly ! Not Believing on Him that Justifeth the one believing !

    Rom 4:5

    But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
     
    #83 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  4. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    Don't you even read the verses you quote? What does Paul say "is counted for righteousness?????? ANSWER "His faith"

    In the KJV have you noticed the "eth" endings on the words "workETH...believETH..imputETH"? That ending tells you it is found in the PRESENT tense and of course "IS counted" translates a present tense.

    Paul is teaching the doctrine of justification BY FAITH from Romans 3:24-5:2 and that is plain as the nose on your face. Get a mirror because it is also plain you cannot see the nose on your face::BangHead:
     
    #84 The Biblicist, May 23, 2012
  5. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    the bib

    Yes, the verse says that God Justifies the Ungodly ! Rom 4:5

    But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
     
    #85 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  6. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    Obviously you do not care what Paul is talking about in this text.

    What kind of justification? ANSWER: Justification based on IMPUTATION - "his faith is COUNTED for righteousness"

    What is the basis of imputation? ANSWER: "HIS FAITH"

    The only kind of Justification of the ungodly in this text and chapter and treatise on justification is justification BY FAITH.

    He is not talking about justification before the world began but BY FAITH and the present tense "justifieth" with the present tense "beleiveth" and the present tense "is counted" PROVES THIS.

    He is not talking about justification as an event that took place prior to the existence of this "ungodly" but the PRESENT TENSE justifieth with the PRESENT TENSE "beleiveth" with the PRESENT TENSE "is counted."

    He is not talking about "justification by grace" AS OPPOSED TO or IN CONTRAST TO "justification by faith" but he is talking about Justification "BY FAITH" as opposed to Justification "BY WORKS."

    He is denying that Justification "BY FAITH" is either "of works" or "by works" but rather is "WITHOUT WORKS" or cannot you read verses 5-6?????


    Your conscience is seared against the truth so that you cannot be honest with the very scriptures you are dealing with! You are illustrating 1 Cor. 2:14 and Romans 8:7 by the very way you deal with these scriptures.
     
    #86 The Biblicist, May 23, 2012
  7. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    the bib

    Obviously you don't, for Paul clearly under inspiration states that God Justifies the Ungodly ! Thats what it means, being Justifed or in a Justified state, ,while being Ungodly, and you reject the Truth. There is no sense in going further with the rest of the verse or passage when you clearly reject that portion !
     
    #87 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  8. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    Regarding Sanctification !

    There is a sanctification of the Elect before the world began. It is done by the Father in the Election of His People in Christ before the foundation of the World when He chose them in Christ Eph 1:4 and who was made unto them sanctification 1 Cor 1:30

    30 But of him[The Father] are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

    This Election set them apart from all of God's other creatures. Jude calls this also Sanctified by God the Father Jude 1:1

    Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:

    This particular sanctification of the Father is before time began,m and it is not the same sanctification of the Son or of the Spirit !

    This also is a Gospel Truth, Just as Jude preached it !
     
    #88 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  9. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    I have never seen anyone so willfully ignorant! You don't even have the honesty and integrity to deal with the text for what it plainly says and the context for what it repeatedly says over and over again.

    Your conscience is seared by false doctrines and it is self-evident as you cannot even be honest.

    You are right about one thing it is useless to discuss anything with you as you have no spiritual abillity to objectively and honestly discuss anything either rationally or reasonably.
     
    #89 The Biblicist, May 23, 2012
  10. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    More arrogant ignorance! Of course the elect are sanctified, glorified, justified, saved, called, and already in heaven as far as God's eternal purpose is concerned.

    "I have PURPOSED it, I WILL DO it" is a text you are completely and totally ignorant of! Go learn what it means:tonofbricks:
     
    #90 The Biblicist, May 23, 2012
  11. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    the bib

    Thats more Truth, when did God put them in Christ ?
     
    #91 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  12. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    Responding to you is futile because you simply do not have the spiritual capacity to understand much of anything.

    1. God CHOSE them "in Christ" before the world began - Eph. 1:4
    2. God placed them "in Christ" REPRESENTATIVELY - Rom. 5:12-19
    3. God CREATED them "in Christ" by new birth - Eph. 2:10
    4. God JUDICIALLY places them "in Christ" by justificaton by faith - Gal. 3:27
    5. God FIGURATIVELY places them "in Christ" in water baptism - Gal. 3:27
    6. God METAPHORICALLY placed them "in Christ" by water baptism - Rom. 6:4-6; 1Cor. 12:27
    7. God EXPERIENTIALLY places them "in Christ" by filling of the Spirit - Col. 2:6; Gal. 3;25; etc.

    Don't bother responding because we already know your errors.
     
    #92 The Biblicist, May 23, 2012
  13. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    the bib

    1 Cor 1:30

    But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

    God the Father put them in Christ Jesus before the foundation of the World ! Eph 1:4

    3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

    4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

    In 2 Tim Paul says in Christ Jesus 2 Tim 1:9

    9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

    Grace was actually given to the Elect in Christ Jesus before the world began ! Now how was it Grace given them in Christ Jesus, if Christ Christ Jesus did not exist but in purpose before the world began ? That Christ Jesus did actually exist before the world began is seen here Jn 17:5

    And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

    And Jn 17:23-24

    23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

    24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

    Now did the Father Love merely a purpose, or did He actually Love His Son before the foundation of the World ?
     
    #93 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  14. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    In Christ Jesus were the elect set apart according as He [ The Father] hath chosen them in Him [Christ] before the foundation, that they should e Holy and without Blame before Him in Love !
     
    #94 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  15. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    The Elect are also Legally sanctified by the Blood of Christ, or the Death of Christ ALONE ! This is documented in the sacred word here Heb 10:10

    By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

    Even before the Elect are born sinners and ungodly, they have been legally set apart for God, just like Jeremiah Illustrates Jer 1:5

    Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

    Yet, it was necessary for Jeremiah as all men in general, to be born children of wrath , by Nature, as others. In other words, Jeremiah was still born a sinner needing to be born again from above ! However he was already set apart for the Holy Purpose of God, yes even when he was by nature ungodly !

    So, even though the elect are not born already born again or regenerated, yet are they born already sanctified, set apart for the Holy Purpose of God, everyone Christ died for !
     
    #95 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  16. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    :tonofbricks: your logic is irrational. You think that since the Son literally and realistically existed before the world began that beings whom God had to create also literally and realistically existed before they were created simply because they were "chosen in him before the world began"! :tonofbricks:


    Ephesians 2;1 is referring to a choice found in God's redemptive purpose which is a SUBSTITUTIONARY purpose or design. Thus to be "chosen in him" means only that Christ would be the substitutionary representative of a purposed people that God would bring into actual existence and in actual reality by something called CREATION! - "I have PURPOSED it, I WILL DO it."
     
    #96 The Biblicist, May 23, 2012
  17. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    the bib

    The Truth is like that to those who are blinded ! Its foolishness to you !
     
    #97 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
  18. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    No, it is foolish because it is foolish thinking not based upon Biblical facts but upon pure eisgesis of scripture.
     
    #98 The Biblicist, May 23, 2012
  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Faith:
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    Dod Good place you in Christ before you were even born, right at birth, or?
     
    #99 Yeshua1, May 23, 2012
  20. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy New Member

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    The Elect are experimentally Sanctified by the Spirit of God in order to bring them unto the Belief of the Truth 2 Thess 2:13; 1 Pet 1:2

    13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

    1 Pet 1:2

    2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

    God in this Sanctification work of the Spirit, brings about their conversion experimentally from the Power of Darkness into the Light of the Glorious Gospel of Christ which He shines into their Hearts, and this separates them from all false Gospels !

    Thus the Elect are Sanctified by the Triune God, the Father, Son, and The Holy Ghost !

    But it began from before the foundation of the World !
     
    #100 savedbymercy, May 23, 2012
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