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Secret plan to keep Iraq under US control?

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by poncho, Jun 6, 2008.

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  1. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    A secret deal being negotiated in Baghdad would perpetuate the American military occupation of Iraq indefinitely, regardless of the outcome of the US presidential election in November.

    The terms of the impending deal, details of which have been leaked to The Independent, are likely to have an explosive political effect in Iraq. Iraqi officials fear that the accord, under which US troops would occupy permanent bases, conduct military operations, arrest Iraqis and enjoy immunity from Iraqi law, will destabilise Iraq's position in the Middle East and lay the basis for unending conflict in their country.

    But the accord also threatens to provoke a political crisis in the US. President Bush wants to push it through by the end of next month so he can declare a military victory and claim his 2003 invasion has been vindicated. But by perpetuating the US presence in Iraq, the long-term settlement would undercut pledges by the Democratic presidential nominee, Barack Obama, to withdraw US troops if he is elected president in November.

    The timing of the agreement would also boost the Republican candidate, John McCain, who has claimed the United States is on the verge of victory in Iraq – a victory that he says Mr Obama would throw away by a premature military withdrawal.

    FULL ARTICLE...
     
    #1 poncho, Jun 6, 2008
  2. Magnetic Poles

    Magnetic Poles New Member

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    If it's secret, how do they know about it?
     
    #2 Magnetic Poles, Jun 6, 2008
  3. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Must have missed the second sentence huh?
     
    #3 poncho, Jun 6, 2008
  4. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards <img src=/Ed.gif>

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    A couple of years ago we celebrated the 60th year of the occupation of Germany (and allies) and Japan (and ally). This is what our victory in World War II looks like. The victory of the USofA (and allies) over Iraq (and ally) means occupation for 60 years (2003-2063). Even yet we snatch defeat from the very jaws of victory :tear: All we need do is turn tail and run. BTW, I don't really see any reason to send my grandchildren to Arkansas to fight for them :(
     
    #4 Ed Edwards, Jun 6, 2008
  5. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Ah yes the ole "end justifies the means" statement again. :rolleyes:
     
    #5 poncho, Jun 6, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 6, 2008
  6. Palatka51

    Palatka51 New Member

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    Great point Ed.

    I'd go even further to state that there are other places that we have occupied longer than that.

    Sense the Spanish American War, Guam.

    Sense the Civil war most Southern States are still housing Federal Troops.

    Sense the Mexican American War, Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada and California.

    Maybe we need to pull out of these areas as well.
     
    #6 Palatka51, Jun 6, 2008
  7. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    I don't really think we need to spend a trillion dollars a year that we don't have, to keep troops in 150 countries.

    That while we leave our borders open, and jail the people who patrol them.

    Do you think those two statements are related ?
     
    #7 Bro. Curtis, Jun 6, 2008
  8. Palatka51

    Palatka51 New Member

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    You can not go into a nation and remove it's government and then leave it's people to their own means. That was the lesson learned from WWI. You have to effect cultural change if you do not want that people to be worse than they were before you went in to clean out the evil.
    Jesus said it very well;

    Matthew 12:43-45
    43When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
    44Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.
    45Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.

    To keep the evil at bay requires great sacrifice. It required the death burial and resurrection of Christ to be able to enter the heart of man when the evil is cast out. Then the eternal indwelling of the Holy Spirit will effect a change of heart.
     
    #8 Palatka51, Jun 6, 2008
  9. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Cultural change huh? We haven't been able to keep evil at bay in our own society so what makes you think we'll have better luck in Iraq? Or do you mean evil as in terrorism? Who do you think taught the Arabs and Persians how to use it in the first place?

    The Israelis turned to terrorism against the British, we ourselves used it against the Iranians in 1953 along with a host of other nations shortly afterward. The government uses it to scare the population of the United States into granting it unconstitutional powers all the time...even more so after 9/11.

    Maybe it's time we put our own house in order and stopped trying to force others into "doing as we say but not as we do". Jesus had a word or two for hypocrites also if I am recalling my bible correctly.
     
    #9 poncho, Jun 6, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 6, 2008
  10. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    That's biblical, too. Have your own house in order before you start telling folks there's is out......
     
    #10 Bro. Curtis, Jun 6, 2008
  11. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    According to an "expert" Iraq is a huge geopolitcal prize. To have "enduring bases" there is a must if the global technocracy wish to control Eurasia. And the technocrats definately wish to have control of Eurasia.

    “The Technocratic Age is slowly designing an every day more controlled society. The society will be dominated by an elite of persons free from traditional values (!) who will have no doubt in fulfilling their objectives by means of purged techniques with which they will influence the behavior of people and will control and watch the society in all details”. “… it will become possible to exert a practically permanent watch on each citizen of the world”.

    - Zbigniew Brzezinski, co-founder of Trilateral Commission

    Who also happens to be Obama's foreign policy guru.
     
    #11 poncho, Jun 6, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 6, 2008
  12. NiteShift

    NiteShift New Member

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    WASHINGTON — The United States is not seeking permanent military bases in Iraq as it negotiates legal and military agreements with the Iraqi government, U.S. Ambassador to Iraq Ryan C. Crocker said June 5.

    Speaking at the State Department, Crocker called published reports that the United States is trying to set up permanent bases "flatly untrue."

    "There clearly is going to be a need" for a U.S. and coalition military presence in Iraq beyond the end of the year, Crocker said. But the status of forces agreement, when adopted, "is not going to be forever, particularly as it related to the status and authority of coalition forces in Iraq," he said.

    "So I’m very comfortable saying to you – to the Iraqis, to anyone who asks – that no, indeed, we are not seeking permanent bases, either explicitly or implicitly, by just intending to stay there indefinitely," he said.

    LINK
     
    #12 NiteShift, Jun 7, 2008
  13. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

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    All of this while we are building the largest US embassy in the world in Iraq - larger than Vatican City, and no doubt, equipped with the latest cutting edge technology. Yep. The AC (Babylon) will sure be able to use it to attack Israel one day, just like the Bible says.....
     
    #13 LadyEagle, Jun 7, 2008
  14. NiteShift

    NiteShift New Member

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    The US is building a new embassy in Bahgdad, as are Sweden, China, United Arab Emirates, Jordan, and others. Claiming that the AntiChrist will rely on the US embassy to attack Israel seems quite a stretch of the imagination LE.
     
    #14 NiteShift, Jun 7, 2008
  15. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Permanent bases? What permanent bases? These bases? Oh! these bases aren't permanent bases, these are "enduring bases". Enduring means..."lasting and durable or to continue in the same state" which is to say they are nothing like permanent bases. Permanent means..."continuing or enduring without fundamental or marked change". See, there's a big difference between permanent bases and enduring bases.
     
    #15 poncho, Jun 7, 2008
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  16. NiteShift

    NiteShift New Member

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    Well where do you see the words "enduring bases"?
     
    #16 NiteShift, Jun 7, 2008
  17. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Google. Only [SIZE=-1]447,000 results though.[/SIZE]

    I've read the PNAC papers too. I know you don't think the neocons would write down their actual agenda and post it on the web for all to see but they did and they said they wanted the whole country of Iraq as an "enduring base" in the mid east.
     
    #17 poncho, Jun 7, 2008
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  18. NiteShift

    NiteShift New Member

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    Yes, and I get 752,000 Google hits for "The bread is in Toledo"

    I thought you might confine your search to Ambassador Crocker's actual statement. Too much to ask,I know.
     
    #18 NiteShift, Jun 7, 2008
  19. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    Well, I just got [SIZE=-1]7,170,000 results for chicken soup. But that has nothing to with the topic at hand either.:rolleyes:

    I thought you might want to broaden your knowledge base a tad but I can see now that it was a miscalculation on my part. Sorry didn't mean to make you think about more than you need to at one time.
    [/SIZE]
     
    #19 poncho, Jun 7, 2008
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  20. poncho

    poncho Well-Known Member

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    #20 poncho, Jun 7, 2008
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