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Southern Seminary Abstract Of Principles

Discussion in 'Baptist Colleges & Seminaries' started by Mark Osgatharp, Sep 5, 2005.

  1. Mark Osgatharp

    Mark Osgatharp New Member

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    Humblesmith and Grayhound,

    A. The abstract does teach unconditional election.

    B. I never said that the abstract connected election to baptism.

    C. There are many Southern Baptist churches which invite all believers to participate in the Lord's supper without regard to whether or not they have been immersed on a profession of faith.

    D. My questions remained unanswered.

    E. I'm not trying to debate the right or wrong of open communion, that would not be a proper subject for this forum.

    F. The reason I ask here is because I want to.

    Mark Osgatharp
     
  2. JGrayhound

    JGrayhound New Member

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    OK...but you asked if Southern enforces it.

    Now, either you really want to know the answer or you wanted to cause a stir and rile people up against Southern.

    If you really wanted to know if Southern enforces it, why do you ask a bunch of people on a message board and not call/write the school/President/Deans, etc?

    I see your point, it does teach unconditional election and "close" communion. I was just trying to figure out why you seem to have such a problem with it. I assume it is because you disagree.
    You say your questions remain unanswered, but the only one I see that hasn't been answered is if Southern enforces it...to which I respond, ask Southern Seminary, because obviously they will know the answer and we don't.
     
  3. Mark Osgatharp

    Mark Osgatharp New Member

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    Grayhound,

    That is the only question I asked in the first place. If you didn't know the answer then the thing for you to do would have been not to have responded. But you said,

    Actually, it is both. I want to know the answer (which I still don't) and I want to rile people up against Southern, which has been a thorn in the Baptist side for over 100 years.

    Mark Osgatharp

    P.S. As for whether or not I agree with the abstract, I agree that immersion on a profession of faith is pre-requisite to participation in the Lord's supper and I disagree that election is unconditional.
     
  4. Hardsheller

    Hardsheller Active Member
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    Mark,

    Are you A Southern Baptist?

    If not then you have absolutely no business trying to rile up any Southern Baptist against one of our institutions.

    Don't be such a naughty person.

    Pro 6:14 Frowardness is in his heart, he deviseth mischief continually; he soweth discord.
     
  5. JGrayhound

    JGrayhound New Member

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    Ah, now we get to the bottom of it.

    What is your problem with Southern? How has it been a "thorn in the Baptist side"?

    PS - I think your original question was answered as best as anyone on here knows how. I said I know for a fact that they DO hold profs accountable to the Abstract and the BFM. I would assume that means that profs do not hold to "open" communion. BUT......if you want the most accurate response, you need to call Southern and not ask a bunch of people on a message board who can't say with 100% accuracy.
     
  6. Paul33

    Paul33 New Member

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    It has been said that Southern is a safe place for both Calvinists and Arminians.

    I believe "election" is conditioned by God's foreknowledge. Those whom he foreknew to be in Christ before the foundation of the world, he elected.

    If I were a professor at Southern, would I be forced out?
     
  7. Hardsheller

    Hardsheller Active Member
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    Yep. No Yankees allowed in jobs that can impact and impress young Southern Ministers to be.

    To answer your question - there are professors at Southern who don't ascribe to 5 point Calvinism.
     
  8. JGrayhound

    JGrayhound New Member

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    Paul, could you agree with this statement?:

    "Election is God's eternal choice of some persons unto everlasting life-not because of foreseen merit in them, but of His mere mercy in Christ-in consequence of which choice they are called, justified and glorified."

    If so, then there is no problem.
    If not, then you should not WANT to teach there, because working there would cause you to violate your conscience in signing that statement.

    (BTW, not to bring the Calvinism thread over here, but if you believe that it was "foreknowledge" as in "foresight" then you do NOT agree with the Abstract and you have twisted the meaning of foreknowledge, and have wiped away Paul's entire argument for election. But that debate is better left for other forums.)

    Back to the main issue, I don't see the problem with the Abstract. I think it is funny (no, wait, I think it is sad) that someone that has personal issues with Southern has tried to slander the school on a message board, and then when asked why he hasn't asked the school about issues, cries "I don't wanna, you can't make me." Is that how we are to handle disagreements? Talk about someone behind their back?

    This whole thread has been a waste.

    BTW, I do still want to hear why Southern has been a "thorn in the side of Baptists".
     
  9. Paul33

    Paul33 New Member

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    Paul, could you agree with this statement?:

    "Election is God's eternal choice of some persons unto everlasting life-not because of foreseen merit in them, but of His mere mercy in Christ-in consequence of which choice they are called, justified and glorified."

    If so, then there is no problem.
    If not, then you should not WANT to teach there, because working there would cause you to violate your conscience in signing that statement.

    (BTW, not to bring the Calvinism thread over here, but if you believe that it was "foreknowledge" as in "foresight" then you do NOT agree with the Abstract and you have twisted the meaning of foreknowledge, and have wiped away Paul's entire argument for election. But that debate is better left for other forums.)

    Back to the main issue, I don't see the problem with the Abstract. I think it is funny (no, wait, I think it is sad) that someone that has personal issues with Southern has tried to slander the school on a message board, and then when asked why he hasn't asked the school about issues, cries "I don't wanna, you can't make me." Is that how we are to handle disagreements? Talk about someone behind their back?

    This whole thread has been a waste.

    BTW, I do still want to hear why Southern has been a "thorn in the side of Baptists".
    </font>[/QUOTE]Yes, I can agree with the above statement.

    I do not believe foreknowledge is foresight.

    I also believe God desires that none perish, provided a way for none to have to perish, and then passed over those he foreknew would persist in rebellion, all this within the being and nature of God.
     
  10. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob Administrator
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    Let's not hijack this thread with bad arminian theology.

    The issue was NOT whether open/closed/close communion or elect by God or elect by man (called foreknowledge) is right or wrong.

    The issue is "Does Southern enforce it?" No one here had the answer and sadly, we saw the REAL motivation for the question was not a simple, honest inquiry.

    No one here knows how it is being enforced. Thread over.
     
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