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The Birth and Nature of Christ

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Heavenly Pilgrim, Jan 23, 2008.

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  1. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    How can we question the power and work of God, for with Him all things are possible?
    Mary's seed is the best possible answer to me. We are all entitled to what we believe. I have believed it was through Mary's seed for many years and have found nothing on here to change my mind. Even Justin said Mary's seed was from David.

    I can find scripture too and have quoted it to no avail.


    Rom 1:3Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

    Notice He "was made of the seed of David". You cannot just throw out the "seed of David" because of something you can't explain about the sinless body. With God all things are possible.

    BBob,
     
    #61 Brother Bob, Jan 23, 2008
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  2. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    Amen! Brother Bob.
     
  3. Eliyahu

    Eliyahu Active Member
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    YOu said this:

    What if in Luke the parentheses which was placed by translators was placed incorrectly and it should of been placed.
    And Jesus Himself began to be about thirty years of age, (being as was supposed the son of Joseph)

    which was the son of Eli..

    which would be saying that Jesus was the son of Heli.

    Luke 3:23 "And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, ..who was the son of Heli,"


    The Bible verse is simple:

    Jesus son of Joseph tou Heli to Matthat....

    Where is the clue that the genealogy is the Mary's genealogy?





    God appeared in Flesh to Abraham, and He appeared to Jacob in flesh. Wasn't He 100% God and 100% Man? If not what was the further requirement?

     
  4. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    It makes no difference whether I left out Joseph or not, he never was in the genelogy line of Jesus. I will research it some more though.

    BBob,
     
  5. Eliyahu

    Eliyahu Active Member
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    I will repeat the same questions again.


    1) How Biological Motherhood can be compatible with Incarnation.
    How did Egg of Mary form a human form while the Word became Flesh.

    2) How the sin nature of the Egg of Mary could be avoided.
     
  6. Eliyahu

    Eliyahu Active Member
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    If the seed of Mary was used, then if the genealogy of Mary was so important, why did Luke omit the name of Mary there while even much less important name of Joseph is mentioned there?
     
  7. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    Gen 3:15And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

    Sfic; if not for the Law of Moses in Numbers, you would be right, but Moses made and exception for the daughters who had no brothers in the inheritance and carrying on the name.


    BBob,
     
  8. Eliyahu

    Eliyahu Active Member
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    You will never be able to explain how the Word became Flesh as long as you maintain the Biological Motherhood.
     
  9. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    Here is what A.T. Robertson says:
     
  10. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    Jhn 4:24God [is] a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship [him] in spirit and in truth.

    Jesus was a Rock, Wisdom, Word, He was in many forms down through time, Tree of Life etc, here He was made flesh. You do know that God could of raised us up from rocks don't you. He did not need a sperm and an egg to make man, but He chose to do it that way. In the case of Jesus it was by the Holy Ghost.

    BBob,
     
  11. Eliyahu

    Eliyahu Active Member
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    That is just a human guesswork, no biblical ground, and jump up in the logic.

    Why not Heli is the father of Joseph's mother? Why did Luke omit the name of Mary? or why didn't he give any clue that it is the genealogy of Mary?

    All the others are human conjecture, and I do not care about it. Such cannot be any basis for the theology.

    Joseph, of course, did not have two fathers. If we understand Luke to be giving the real genealogy of Jesus through Mary, the matter is simple enough


    If we believe that the genealogy is the mother side of Joseph, it is simple too.
     
  12. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    It is not just guesswork. Read the rest of the post and the rest of the reasons that are given, not just my hi-lighted statement.
     
  13. Linda64

    Linda64 New Member

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    Jesus is THE Rock, not a literal rock.

    1 Corinthians 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

    Where in Scripture does it say that Jesus is the Tree of Life?

    Proverbs 3:18 She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her.

    The "she" in this verse is speaking of "wisdom"...not Christ...besides Christ isn't a "she".

    God didn't raise men up from rocks, He formed man from the dust of the ground

    Genesis 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

    Therefore, He is able to implant His seed in the womb without needing Mary's egg. To say that He needed Mary's egg in order to produce the Christ-child is limiting the very thing that God told Mary would happen to her "the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee" (Luke 1:35)

    Luke 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
     
    #73 Linda64, Jan 23, 2008
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  14. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    God is able to do many things.
    But that is not what the Bible teaches and that is the problem with many of the arguments that are presented here. They are suppositional arguments. They are not based on Scripture. They are: God is able, Suppose, What if, Why can't, etc.
    One can't make an argument from silence and from suppositions. You must be able to start with a Biblical premise not a supposition, a "what if"
     
  15. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    2Ti 2:8Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel:


    The word will stand when the world is on fire!

    BBob,
     
    #75 Brother Bob, Jan 23, 2008
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  16. standingfirminChrist

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    DHK, practice what you're preaching. The Bible does not say an egg was used. But your argument is that it was.

    You are teaching a Christadelphian doctrine. They teach that the Word became an egg first and then became flesh.
     
    #76 standingfirminChrist, Jan 23, 2008
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  17. standingfirminChrist

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    Brother Bob, again you ignore the fact that seed of David does not mean bloodline. It is offspring.

    Jesus was Mary's offspring only because He came from her loins. Her egg was not used.
     
  18. Heavenly Pilgrim

    Heavenly Pilgrim New Member

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    HP: When one thinks normally about the import of the word ‘begat’ it clearly involves intercourse. That was not the case with Jesus, therefore I believe the word begat was omitted seeing the actual implantation of the seed was accomplished by the Holy Spirit.

    I have to have faith in the translators, in that they correctly placed the quotation marks. You change the whole meaning of the verse when you decide for yourself that they might be wrong and suggest that you can simply move them where it might be convenient for ones ideas. I shudder at the thought of twisted rendering one might conjure up following such a suggestion in other verses as well. I would consider your suggestion as a pathway to darkness, with the end being a great darkness and blight upon the truth of the Word of God.

    Bear in mind I understand full well that we are simply reasoning together, and I believe you simply threw this notion out as a mere possibility and in actuality you do not believe such would be a proper handling of the Word of God…..or at least that would be my hope.
     
  19. Heavenly Pilgrim

    Heavenly Pilgrim New Member

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    HP: I am still awaiting an answer from DHK and others on this issue. This was a primary question in the OP.
     
  20. standingfirminChrist

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    AT Robertson on Romans 8:3
    PHP:
    In the likeness of sinful flesh (en 
    homoiômatisarkos hamartias
    ). For 
    "likeness" see Php 2:7a real man
    but more than man for God's "own 
    Son." Two genitives "of flesh of sin" 
    (marked by sin), that is the flesh of man 
    is, but not the flesh of Jesus. 
    Since Jesus' flesh is not marked by sin, it cannot be of Mary's egg.
     
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