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Featured The Conservative Baptist Conflict

Discussion in 'Baptist History' started by Squire Robertsson, Jul 8, 2017.

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  1. TCassidy

    TCassidy Administrator
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    What part of the faith as taught in God's word is non-essential? What part of God's word can we ignore?
     
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  2. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Is the only option to ignore? Can it also be just a difference of understanding? I means does everyone always have to be exactly right about everything according to TCassidy or he will separate? Really?
     
  3. TCassidy

    TCassidy Administrator
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    He stated that some portions of "the faith once delivered to the saints" were non-essential. I just wondered how he could believe any part of "the faith once delivered" could be non-essential and how he determines what is essential and what is non-essential.

    Not the point. There are many differences of understanding among Baptists. But how do we determine if those differences of understanding are essential or non-essential?

    I don't recall saying that. Could you post a quote from me including thread and post #?

    No, not really. You just made it up.
     
  4. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    Jerome has dutifully found and graciously linked to the Doctrinal Statement known as the Goodchild Confession. I have typed it for the convenience of BB readers:

    The executive committee of the Fundamental Fellowship, chaired by Frank Marsden Goodchild (1860-1928), proposed “to restate the foundation doctrines of our faith in the following brief and simple confession which is but a re-affirmation of the substance of the historic Philadelphia and New Hampshire Confessions of Faith:”
    1. We believe that the Bible is God’s word, that it was written by men divinely inspired, and that is has supreme authority in all matters of faith and conduct.
    2. We believe in God the Father, perfect in holiness, infinite in wisdom, measureless in power. We rejoice that he concerns himself mercifully in the affairs of men, that he hears and answers prayer, and that he saves from sin and death all who come to him through Jesus Christ.
    3. We believe in Jesus Christ, God’s only begotten Son, miraculous in his birth, sinless in his life, making atonement for the sins of the world by his death. We believe in his bodily resurrection, his ascension in to heaven, his perpetual intercession for his people and his personal visible return to the world according to his promise.
    4. We believe in the Holy Spirit who came forth from God to convince the world of sin, of righteousness and of judgment, and to regenerate, sanctify and comfort those who believe in Jesus Christ.
    5. We believe that all men by nature and by choice are sinners but that “God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life;” we believe therefore that those who accept Christ as Savior and Lord will rejoice forever in God’s presence and those who refuse to accept Christ as Savior and Lord will be forever separated from God.
    6. We believe in the church—a living spiritual body of which Christ is the head and of which all regenerated people are members. We believe that a visible church is a company of believers in Jesus Christ, baptized on a credible confession of faith, and associated in worship, work and fellowship. We believe that to these visible churches were committed, for perpetual observance, the ordinances of baptism and the Lord’s Supper, and that God has laid upon these churches the task of persuading a lost world to accept Jesus Christ as Savior, and to enthrone him as Lord and Master. We believe that all human betterment and social improvement are the inevitable by-products of such a gospel.
    7. We believe that every human being has direct relations with God, and is responsible to God alone in all matters of faith; that each church is independent and autonomous and must be free from interference by any ecclesiastical or political authority; that therefore Church and State must be kept separate as having different functions, each fulfilling its duties free from the dictation or patronage of the other.

    [Source: The Baptist, Vol. II, No. 22, July 2, 1921, Arthur W. Cleaves, editor; Chicago, IL: Northern Baptist Convention, p. 684]
     
    #84 rlvaughn, Dec 21, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
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  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The essentials of the Faith are those doctrines that ALL christians must uphold to be seen as being really one of us, things such as Physical resurrection of Jesus, Jesus death on Cross only way to forgive our sins, must be born again, there is a Second Coming.

    We can disagree on things like baptism modes, timing of second coming, worship styles, bible versions etc!
     
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  6. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    It's worth noting the convention as a whole refused over the years to require missionaries it supported to agree to this confession. This refusal became the nexus of the various splits.
     
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  7. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    Not if you claim to be a Baptist.
     
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  8. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    Agreeing to disagree on "non-essentials" may sound magnanimous, but it is usually just an excuse to continue to slide into theological liberalism. Spurgeon faced the same dilemma with the downgrade controversy.
     
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  9. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I am a Baptist, and do see believers baptism as the best way to do it, but would not exclude from fellowship those sucha s a Presbartarian who sees it as infanr baptism mode!
     
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  10. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    Fine. But don't call them Baptists.
     
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  11. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    The Bible

    Does your redemption rely on this?

    Does your redemption rely on this?

    I really can't believe that anyone thinks it's sinful to listen to CCM. I'll grant that it's often really crappy music.

    Yes. That is the perpetual problem when adding extra-biblical tests of orthodoxy, which is nothing less than legalism.

    When someone says, you can't be a Christian if you listen to CCM, view R-rated movies, drink, chew, or go with girls who do. . . you are creating a test of orthodoxy, which is unbiblical, and reveals where your legalism lies.

    Liberals have these extra-biblical tests of orthodoxy as well. They are just different. They might say, you can't be a Christian if you are a Republican, if you are "homophobic", Islamophobic. . .

    Whether Left or Right, there are countless millions filling pews who are not relying on the gospel of Christ, but on their own righteousness. That's a serious problem.
     
  12. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    Neither would I. Baby dedication is dry baptism, and Protestants who baptize infants don't think it salvific, so Reformed Baptists and Conservative Presbyterians (PCA) have far, far more in common that Reformed Baptists and mega-church semi-Pelagian or IFB, Arminians.
     
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  13. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I don't, just fellow Christians!
     
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  14. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Yes, as we would agree on the essentials of the Faith!
     
  15. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    It's difficult. I know that very well, but we must resist making secondary issues essential issues.

    The thief on the cross didn't have much theology to agree or disagree with, yet Christ promised him a place at the table. What were his views on end times???
     
  16. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Or on what mode of water baptism?
     
  17. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    It gets CRAZY! How about for how long a dunk? Does it count if you weren't under for more than 10 seconds? I'm surprised there aren't a few Baptist churches out there with a name which reflects their position on the time it takes for a sinner to be underwater in baptism. "One Minute Baptist Church". It could turn to be a contest. . .

    Dear Lord, I hope I didn't give anyone an idea. . .
     
  18. thatbrian

    thatbrian Well-Known Member
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    My brother, Teshua1, is a smart guy. He can tell a Baptist from a Presbyterian. He can tell by the highwater mark.
     
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  19. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Usually it all depends on if just the hair only got wet or not!
     
  20. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    ( open vs closed communion)
    Well, Brian- I would like to agree with you - but who determines what the Bible teachers.
    Those who believe in closed comminuin will show you verses that prove their point.
    those who believe in open communion can show you verses that prove their point or some would say the Scriptures do not require it.
    It comes down to one thing - interpretation


    Brian - here is some earth shattering news- The Roman Catholic Bible belives in the Bible -

    BUT - they interpret much different that we do.
     
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