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The Cross of Christ discussion

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by evangelist6589, Sep 12, 2014.

  1. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    The unbeliever I am chatting with that I mentioned earlier seems interested in challenging his views or I have persuaded him to do so. The verses I sent his way defending the atonement bounce right off him so I suggested books to better comment on the Bible. He did not want to buy a
    systematic theology so chose the book The Cross of Christ by John Stott. Me and him will be going through this book together. But no doubt his view denying the blood of Christ and his liberal theology views I would place him outside orthodoxy.

    If anyone is also interested in going through this book to aide me in helping my friend please buy the book and let's have a online class discussion. We will read various chapters and discuss it and do some pop quizzes. I am already doing the same with another poster on the topic of evangelism. Anyone interested please let me know thanks...

    If you do not read books but only the Bible just to let you know I am aware of a dozen verses defending a vicarious atonement and have explained then but my friend needs a scholarly commentary which I am not.
     
    #1 evangelist6589, Sep 12, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 12, 2014
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    .That is a very good book, right up there with Knowing God...
     
  3. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    I thought you did not read books but only the Bible? Yes thanks I will look forward to discussing and reading the book with this Catholic.
     
  4. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist Active Member
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    Be forewarned, though, IF you do not know already.
    Most Catholics do not accept Sola Scriptura.
    They will quote others as authorities also, even customs, traditions, etc.
     
  5. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    I know. But at least he wants to reason with me. How many Humanists would do this?
     
  6. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    That's ok. 98% of the people on this board don't accept Sola Scriptura. The web links, copy/paste jobs, and references to others for authority should be enough to see that.

    Heck, at one time I thought Evan was Sola MacArthura.
     
  7. blessedwife318

    blessedwife318 Well-Known Member
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    Sola Scriptura is given lip service in many circles but is practically denied. As I heard I think from Justin Peters we have won for the part the war for inerrancy but we don't even realize we are losing the war on the sufficiency of Scripture. If I had a non Christian willing to discuss a book with me you can bet it would be a book of the Bible most likely John. Let the Word of God do its work. You don't have to defend a lion just let it out of the cage.
     
  8. Thousand Hills

    Thousand Hills Active Member

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    THIS!!! :thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
     
  9. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    You misunderstand. The Bible is the authority and when Mac departs from it (which is rare but does sometimes happen) I say he is wrong. I also recently tossed some books that claimed Christ, but used more psychology than Bible and it was obvious the Word was not their authority.
     
    #9 evangelist6589, Sep 18, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 18, 2014
  10. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    I give out dozens of Gospel of John's on my witness on the streets. I also gave my Catholic friend many verses in support of the sub atonement but he spit them all out. He also claims to have read John. Sometimes a book on the atonement which obviously uses loads of scripture but explains them well would be better.
     
  11. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    From what translation?
    There is a time for abbreviations --but please refer to it as the penal substitutionary atonement. "Sub atonement" just doesn't cut it.
     
  12. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    NIV/ESV and sometimes the KJV.

    www.ptl.org
     
  13. Don

    Don Well-Known Member
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    You do realize that you just proved their point for them, right?
     
  14. Don

    Don Well-Known Member
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    (double post)
     
    #14 Don, Sep 18, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 18, 2014
  15. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    But Sola Scriptura isn't a matter of whether their view comes from scripture or not. When they are your go-to authority for spiritual matters, then you have departed from Sola Scriptura.

    I offended my pastor's wife last night in our bible study on Born Again. About 6 times she said, "well for me, I need to be the one to close the deal" or "for me....."

    I said "lady, I don't give one hoot what you think about it or how you feel about it. I care about one thing - where do you find your position in the scriptures?"

    See, she has made herself the authority. Many here have made philosophical reasoning their authority. They've put the scriptures down, and are arguing from empty philosophy.

    Every time you say, "I'm going to what Mac has to say about it", then you have indeed abandoned Sola Scriptura. You've made the opinions of men your authority.

    Just like the RCC. They said "WE will tell you what scripture means. WE are the authority"
     
  16. blessedwife318

    blessedwife318 Well-Known Member
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    Good post.
    Can commentaries be helpful, Yes but when it comes to authority our first and only response should be "the Bible Say..." It is the Word of God that is living and active able to divide soul and spirit. No other book or person can do that.
     
  17. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    I always go to the Bible and check it out. I just like Mac which you do not as it's obvious.
     
  18. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
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    Exactly! But also remember Ephesians 4. God gave teaches.
     
  19. JamesL

    JamesL Well-Known Member
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    Yes. Good stuff.
     
  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    No, its that while i have read and learned a lot from systematic theologies, survey books, introductions etc, the ONLY book to get doctrines and practices are the bible itself...

    other sources can agree with the bible, but the Bible itself is only inspired source...
     
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