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The fastest way to solve the health care crisis

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by Crabtownboy, Mar 25, 2017.

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  1. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    [​IMG]
     
    #1 Crabtownboy, Mar 25, 2017
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  2. Happy

    Happy Well-Known Member
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    Health care CRISIS? uh.... Insurance does not "insure" a person will be healthy. Whether or not a person buys a product called insurance is not crisis.
     
    #2 Happy, Mar 26, 2017
  3. Happy

    Happy Well-Known Member
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    Why?
    Forcing a servant of the government to buy anything is no more constitutional than forcing an other citizen to buy anything.
     
    #3 Happy, Mar 26, 2017
  4. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    Nothing here that says we would force them (like they forced us to do) - - - but we certainly don't have to buy them exclusive, high-cost plans that insulate them from the costs the rest of is have to pay.

    Rob
     
    #4 Deacon, Mar 26, 2017
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  5. Happy

    Happy Well-Known Member
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    How were you "forced" to buy insurance?
     
    #5 Happy, Mar 26, 2017
  6. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Not really. But if I didn't buy it I would face a penalty.

    Are you "forced" to drive under 65 mph? Are you "forced" to pay property taxes?

    Sent from my Moto Droid Turbo.
     
    #6 InTheLight, Mar 26, 2017
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  7. Happy

    Happy Well-Known Member
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    Why? Are you a foreigner, which the Feds have legal jurisdiction over? Are you a naturalized citizen, which the Feds have legal jurisdiction to withdraw your citizenship? Where in all of the US Fed Const. does the Fed government have legal authority to compel (force) a natural citizen to buy anything or be fined?

    I didn't agree to buy insurance.
    I did agree to obey traffic laws, and even speed signs are primia facia evidence, and why warnings, no ticket and tickets may or may not be issued. It's discretionary.
    I did agree to pay property taxes, when I agreed to buy property, and even that has loop holes, if one uses the law for their benefit, instead of only as a burden.

    Per the insurance ~ absolutely they say "you may" have to pay a fine. That is not the law, it is a rendering position of the Feds, because their speech is for anyone to hear, foreign (whom they HAVE exclusive jurisdiction over) and any one who is domestic and desires their provisions.
     
    #7 Happy, Mar 26, 2017
  8. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    The fastest way to solve the health care crisis

    ...Is to not create one in the first place!
     
    #8 Benjamin, Mar 26, 2017
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  9. just-want-peace

    just-want-peace Well-Known Member
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    Fer instance, GET GOVT OUT OF THE HEALTHCARE BUSINESS!!!
     
    #9 just-want-peace, Mar 26, 2017
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  10. FollowTheWay

    FollowTheWay Well-Known Member
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    The law says you WILL have to pay a fine. Recognize reality.
     
    #10 FollowTheWay, Mar 26, 2017
  11. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
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    The fastest way to solve the health care crisis

    We all kill ourselves, and then there's no need for one.
     
    #11 Alcott, Mar 26, 2017
  12. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    Have you filed your tax return yet? You MUST prove you have insurance for all 12 months [another unfunded mandate & govt reqired paperwork for the employer]

    If you dont - that you are required to pay a "tax" for not having medical insurance; which will be added to you IRS 1040. If you dont do that - and (I'm sure the IRS will keep an eye out for it) you will then be charged interest and late charge for late taxes.
     
    #12 Salty, Mar 26, 2017
  13. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    Public Law 111–148, found constitutional by the US Supreme Court in National Federation of Independent Business v. Sebelius, 567 U.S. (2012), 183 L. Ed. 2d 450, 132 S.Ct. 2566.
     
    #13 TCassidy, Mar 26, 2017
  14. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    That is Federal LAW - - I know- you stated that the SCUS ruled is constitutional -.... But the "right" to health care still is not in the Constitution
     
    #14 Salty, Mar 26, 2017
  15. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    The preamble of the Constitution proves you incorrect on this one. It reads [I added the highlight]:

    We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
     
    #15 Crabtownboy, Mar 27, 2017
  16. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    The Supreme Court of the United States says it is.
     
    #16 TCassidy, Mar 27, 2017
  17. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    IF that is the case - then why was there not govt health care right from the beginning?????

    This article may help explain

    According to James Madison, the clause authorized Congress to spend money, but only to carry out the powers and duties specifically enumerated in the subsequent clauses of Article I, Section 8, and elsewhere in the Constitution, not to meet the seemingly infinite needs ofthe general welfare.

    HMMM - wasn't James Madison the Father of the Constitution? Wouldn't he know what me meant when he wrote it?


    and BTW, sometimes the SCOTUSs has been wrong as they have overruled themselves.
     
    #17 Salty, Mar 27, 2017
  18. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
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    Explain what 'the right to health care' means; keeping in mind the right to the free exercise of religion means anyone can practice any religion-- but the government cannot pay for it.
     
    #18 Alcott, Mar 27, 2017
  19. Happy

    Happy Well-Known Member
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    You forgot to quote the law. :)

    Title, Section, Sub-section and legal quote is acceptable.
     
    #19 Happy, Mar 27, 2017
  20. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    The Supreme Court allowed the use of A1, S8, Clause 3, to be the enumerated power to find ACA constitutional as long as the fees were considered a tax.

    There were two governing points:

    1. The Commerce clause invoked. (The health of the people is a prerequisite to Interstate Commerce.)

    2. Congress has the right to levy taxes. (The fees and fines were a tax.)
     
    #20 TCassidy, Mar 27, 2017
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