The Historical Baptist Position on Baptism. CHAPTER 1: WATER BAPTISM: PROPER MODE.

@xlsdraw I am only tagging you in case you want to continue with me in proving to me that the only water baptism that has been practiced is by immersion which I can concur that there are examples of that in scriptures but failing to see it as a commandment to be water baptized by immersion as I cannot see it can be done every time a believer is saved for discipleship and for as a public witness.

If however you do not wish to walk me through this journey, maybe Alan Gross and others will.

Brother Alan,

When I read this from that first epistle from Peter...

1 Peter 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

22 Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.

I apply verse 21 as deferring from water baptism since water is used to put away the filth of the flesh, but instead to the answer of a good conscience towards God by believing in the Lord Jesus Christ, hence the baptism with the Holy Ghost.

So when I read your reference of baptism in Romans 6:4-5 I read that as referring to that baptism of the Holy Ghost whenever anyone believes in Jesus Christ.

Kind of like this reference that some Baptists misapply as water baptism as necessary for salvation when I apply that as that promise of the forever indwelling Holy Ghost for all those that come to & believe in Jesus Christ.
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Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

I'll be reading & addressing the rest of your opening post to determine whether or not water baptism can only be recognized and be done by immersion.

 

One problem here, Brother Aalan, in regards to the article by Berlin Hisel. Philip was preaching the gospel to the Samaritans and was casting out unclean spirits. When they believed and got water baptized in Jesus's name, they were not saved yet as they had not received the promise of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 8:5 Then Philip went down to the city of Samaria, and preached Christ unto them.

6 And the people with one accord gave heed unto those things which Philip spake, hearing and seeing the miracles which he did.

7 For unclean spirits, crying with loud voice, came out of many that were possessed with them: and many taken with palsies, and that were lame, were healed.

8 And there was great joy in that city.

9 But there was a certain man, called Simon, which beforetime in the same city used sorcery, and bewitched the people of Samaria, giving out that himself was some great one:

10 To whom they all gave heed, from the least to the greatest, saying, This man is the great power of God.

11 And to him they had regard, because that of long time he had bewitched them with sorceries.

12 But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.

13 Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done.

14 Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:

15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:

16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)

17 Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost.

18 And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,

19 Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.

20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.

21 Thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter: for thy heart is not right in the sight of God.

22 Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee.

23 For I perceive that thou art in the gall of bitterness, and in the bond of iniquity.

24 Then answered Simon, and said, Pray ye to the Lord for me, that none of these things which ye have spoken come upon me.

25 And they, when they had testified and preached the word of the Lord, returned to Jerusalem, and preached the gospel in many villages of the Samaritans.

In understanding what had happened here with the Lord's help, the people believed in the "things" that Philip was preaching about as they and even Simon the sorcerer was following Philip around out of fanfare and so they were not really coming to & believing in Jesus Christ for salvation. They just did whatever Philip told them to do as they were just being fans of Philip following him around seeing all the miracles happening by Philip rather than by the Lord Jesus Christ.

The fact that Simon had infamy for bewitching the people of the area with unclean spirits is why the focus of the people was on Philip rather than on Jesus Christ.

Even Simon still had to have the Lord's help to lift his sight higher as he had thought he could buy the power from Peter & John to be able to give the Holy Ghost like they seemingly did by the laying on of their hands.

So these potential believers were water baptized by someone in authority such as Philip BUT they did not receive the promise of the Holy Spirit even after that water baptism, because their sights were on Philip just as Simon's sights were still on man when he had assumed in error that Peter & John had the power to give the Holy Ghost when they did not.

So by forcing the issue of only the right Baptist church can water baptized anyone, then that is directing their gaze to man and not to God the Father Whom baptizes any believer that comes to & believe in His Son with the promise of the Holy Ghost.

So I disagree with Berlin Hisel on that point.

Although the reference in Acts 8th chapter did not mention water baptism by immersion, I would think that is what had happened there when Philip was out there in the region where I am sure a body of water was available for that purpose.

This is the same reference and line of righty dividing the word of truth that I have with Pentecostals & Charismatics that insist that saved believers can receive the Holy Spirit apart from salvation as if they can receive Him again, but I point out that verse 16 testifies that they did not have the Holy Ghost yet but were just water baptized in His name and so they cannot use that to teach that saved believers can receive the Holy Spirit again apart from salvation when they never had Him in the first place.

Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Anyway, there is that.

Berlin Hisel, whether he realizes this or not, is practically giving the RCC validation for saved believers to only receive that water baptism done by the RCC as they consider water baptism as a sacrament as necessary for obtaining salvation within the RCC. Hopefully, they will not refer to his work in validating their line of falsehood but it goes to show why we should abstain from all appearances of evil when it is the Father that baptizes any believer with the promise of the forever indwelling Holy Ghost for when they come to & believe in Jesus Christ as water baptism by any specific person or church is not required to make that happen..

 

Although I do not believe in infant baptism nor baptismal regeneration, I do point out that without water baptism, a saved believer is baptized by the Holy Ghost in accomplishing the same manner and metaphors as depicted below.

(Romans 6:4-5; "Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. 5For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:")

1 Peter 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

22 Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.

I apply verse 21 as deferring from water baptism since water is used to put away the filth of the flesh, but instead to the answer of a good conscience towards God by believing in the Lord Jesus Christ, hence the baptism with the Holy Ghost.

So when I read your reference of baptism in Romans 6:4-5 I read that as referring to that baptism of the Holy Ghost whenever anyone believes in Jesus Christ.

Repeating what I had posted earlier.

There is no denying the reference citing baptism by immersion but can it be said that this was done every time as following whenever someone got saved at the hearing of the gospel?

Not really. Romans 6:1-5 can very well be talking about the baptism with the Holy Ghost.

Well, I am attempting to research this in finding the scriptures for that point of relevance.

Since the Lord's hand is not short in saving anyone in the absence of water when they come to & believe in Jesus Christ, if Paul did not stress the importance of water baptism here, then why stress water baptism can only be done by immersion?

1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God...

.....21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

The problem here is how can you be sure this is referring to water baptism by immersion and not the baptism with the Holy Ghost at our salvation moment when we are born again of the Spirit?

It would be interesting if I did find scriptures that testify to sprinkling form of water baptism, but currently I have not found any yet let alone, infers that kind of water baptism.

 

@Alan Gross & @John of Japan & @xlsdraw

Ezekiel 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

There are a lot of verses regarding the sprinkling of the blood that cleanses as well but I will not bother with that aspect.

The Book of Numbers also list a few references of the actual sprinkling of water for several cleansing purposes. Numbers 8:7 & Numbers 19:13 & Numbers 19:18-21

Nothing about sprinkling of water as a form of water baptism in the New Testament yet.

The one below is not to be taken as such an example.

Hebrews 10:21 And having an high priest over the house of God;

22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised

I am sure Hebrews 10:21-23 has nothing to do with water baptism, but the baptism with the Holy Ghost.

Titus 3:4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Anyway, so far, I find no New Testament example of water baptism by sprinkling but then again, it is the baptism with the Holy Ghost that counts for salvation rather than any specific form of water baptism to be insisted upon for discipleship.

 

Yes. This is where interperters on this matter disagree.

 

Hopefully neither side will judge the other as not a true Baptist or not a true Christian when Jesus Christ in us is able to make us stand without water baptism at all since salvation is not dependent on it nor is it required to enable us to follow Christ when looking to Jesus Christ daily to help us resist sin and do good is how we are able to follow Him.