The horrible ecummenicism of Mother Theresa

And I'm sure that she has not seen yours. What does that prove except that you don't know everything her and that she did not consider you the supreme arbiter of who accepts Jesus as Lord. Have you read everything she wrote? Have you read anything she wrote (besides little snippets posted on bulletin boards)? A friend of mine has a book (sorry, can't remember the name at the moment) where she states the requirements for women who wanted to join her order. The first requirement is that they have a love of and relationship with Jesus. (In other words, what you would call a "personal relationship"). Perhaps you should do a little research before you try to dis someone. Anyone who does not think that Mother Teresa believed that Jesus is the Son of God, the Messiah, just ain't paying attention!

Catholic Dad

 

Catholic Convert,

I too, get the "Voice of the Martyrs." I believe you are right that if you are a real witness to the saving message of Jesus Christ you will be persecuted. In the land of India with their mega-thousands of gods, the sister would have experienced real hatred and persecution. She did a lot of good for the dying but so do Oncologists around the world.

It seems like every so often the pope elevates a Catholic to a place of public notice. What about all the other sisters and brothers of the faith that are doing wonderful things. Being an outsider to your church it seems unfair to the rest of the energetic souls who are doing good and pleasing the Lord.

What do you think about the other hard working children of God?

 

Hope you don't mind me butting in Ray.
Here is my answer. How do you like it:

Corinthians 12:26
And if one member suffers, all the members suffer with it; IF ONE MEMBER IS HONORED ALL THE MEMBERS REJOICE WITH IT.

God bless all those other nuns. They will also recieve their reward. There of course will be no envy or jealousy in heaven so why should we encourage or entertain such envy now and jealousy now.

Blessings

 

Yes I read it and I asked a simple question about it ... a question which you did not answer. I am dead serious about this question.

This is not what you said. You said "the church has ... compromised the truth." (Look in the first paragraph of your first post if you think I am making this up. I have quoted your exact words.) By "truth" did you mean "actions" or did you mean "truth"?

I think it went out the window long ago, and I was not questioning who the quotes came from. I was asking what authority you have to judge that the church has compromised the truth, which is explicitly what you said.

So I ask again, By what authority do you declare that the church has compromised the truth? How is that different than when I declare that the church has compromised the truth?

 

I love the way Baptist love pointing the finger at other faiths. We're such a holier than thou ilk. May God forgive us for our pious attitudes.

 

Actually, Hinduism can be pretty tolerant of Christians because many just believe that Jesus Christ is just another manifestation of Brahman/Atman. Granted, they are wrong, but they don't take the same offense as a Muslim would, for instance.

 

Sounds like a good idea to me.

-Neil

 

Johnv,

It is not only Baptists doing this here. An Eastern Orthodox Catholic started this thread and is pointing the finger as well. Good try, though.

In Christ,
Neal

 

thessalonian,

I liked very much your answer about the other sisters of the faith who work on behalf of and worship Jesus Christ most actively. We have no question but that the Lord will reward each of us fairly; it is down here that sometimes justice does not take place. Good anwer.

 

Ed,

Is this "traditionalist" website Novus Ordo Watch? Are they loyal to the magesterium, or have they separated themselves?

 

My guess is the 5000 nuns in her order just see her as an example of faith for them and do not harbor any ill will toward the Churches recognition of her starting an order that runs over 500 schools and hospitals in over 100 nations I believe it is. This was accomplished after walking out the door of her previous order with nothing but the clothes on her back.

Hebrews 6:12
so that you will not be sluggish, but imitators of those who through faith and patience inherit the promises.

Hebrews 13:7
Remember those who led you, who spoke the word of God to you; and considering the result of their conduct, imitate their faith.


I see no injustice in recognizing God's work through this woman of faith. I know a woman who was at the cerimony last week. I don't think there was one of the 300,000 people there who thought that Church was doing an injustice to anyone in recognizing her accomplishements. I have never heard such a claim within the Church.

Blessings

 

The presence of any human help in sanctification is never mentioned, in scripture. Moreover, sanctification is a one time, complete event. Not a gradual stepladder to sainthood. The pope has no power to forgive, therefore has no power to sanctify.

Every mention of sanctify, in any form of the word, in the New Testament, comes from the Greek...
hagiazo (purify, consecrate) the act
hagiazmos (purity, purification) the state

And in every verse I found, sactification comes from the Lord. Not fromanyone else.

(easy information to find)

Now I allready know yer gonna tell me some ancient pope was told by God that he needed his help in deciding who or not to sanctify, but I say, from what I read in scripture, that if Theresa is a saint, it's because of Christ Jesus, not the pope. And if she isn't, all the pomp and circumstance Rome can conjure up won't help her.

 

My comment was not intended to point the finger at another faith. My point was to find out why Ed was willing to be inconsistent about who is allowed to question the church. He has repeatedly condemned me and others for saying that the RCC has compromised the truth. We are said to be in rebellion against the Holy Mother Church. And Ed has "prayed" for me to come home to the church. Yet he questions the church himself by saying that they have "compromised the truth."

My (unanswered) question remains: By what authority has he decided that the RCC has "compromised the truth"? And how is that different from my decision that they have compromised the truth.

I hope he will attempt to give some sort of answer to this.

He said I accept and practice the doctrines, teachings, morality, and councils of the Roman rite. What I am troubled by are some of the personal practices of people in the Roman rite. And my quotes came from a Traditionalist Roman rite web site, so there are those in the Roman rite who also have serious misgivings about such behavior. It is not the same to criticize behavior as it is to disagree with doctrinal truth.

But this is not helpful because in his initial post, he did not only criticize practice, he explicitly said that the church has "compromised the truth." Now perhaps by "truth" he meant something other than "truth," something like "praxis" or "actions" or something to that affect. But that is not what he said.

Though he questions Mother Theresa, just two weeks ago (if memory serves me correctly) the RCC held her up as a model in the church by beatification. In other words, it appears that the RCC put their official stamp of approval on her life and work. Ed apparently thinks they should not have done that (though I don't wish to put words in his mouth). In any event, I don't think this can simply be glossed over as if he didn't say what he said. And it is not a matter of pointing fingers. I am interested in when it is okay to criticize the Holy See and by what authority such criticism is done.

I would also be interested to know from a Catholic if a beatification is an ex cathedra work of the Pope, if it possesses the character of infallibility. Does anyone know?

In any case, it appears to me that there is an inconsistency here and I am simply looking for clarification. I have gone out of my way not to be inflammatory about it.

 

Also, since I'm sure that the pope is speaking "ex-cathedra" or whatever, and we all know about his infallibility, and all......

Is the sin Brother Ed mentioned only a venial one, or a mortal one ?

Is the pope able to petition Mary or someone to look over her liberal attitude towards the gospel, because of her humanitarian efforts ?

Are people in hell today because they listened to her ?

 

Sorry, pastor....

We posted at the same time with the same question, almost...

 

Curtis,

The pope does not make any person a saint. Canonization is the declaration of that which is already true - it is letting the people of God know that this person is a saint. Canonization is not a making, just like the canon of Scripture is simply the "list" of Scriptures. The canon of saints is just a list of known saints. If the Church declares Mother Teresa a saint, then we know that she is; however, there are countless saints in heaven that the Church has not recognized simply because no one makes a case for them.

Larry,

If Blessed Teresa is declared to be Saint Teresa, brother Ed will have to comply with this decision, as it is infallible.

I questioned him on the same thing you do, and it is my understanding now that he did not mean that doctrines were being corrupted, but that he believes the witness of some doctrines is being corrupted by certain individuals or actions. He did not word what he meant correctly. He is not questioning the Church, but actions of specific people within the Church. However, again, if she is declared a saint, as a Catholic, he is obliged to except this ruling.

 

"Moreover, sanctification is a one time, complete event."

Well your partially right. It is complete in baptism. However:


1 Thessalonians 5:23
Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Haven't they already been santified?


Hebrews 12:14
Pursue peace with all men, and the sanctification without which no one will see the Lord.


How can they pursue what is behind them and done?
Now santification is complete in baptist as I stated. But it is quite apparent from scriopture that we can become unsanctified.


1 Thessalonians 4:3
For this is the will of God, your sanctification; that is, that you abstain from sexual immorality;