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The paradigm of worship

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by ScottEmerson, Aug 16, 2003.

  1. ScottEmerson

    ScottEmerson Active Member

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    How many times "I", "me", "we", "my", or "us" appears in certain psalms.

    Psalm 100 - 3
    Psalm 23 - 17
    Psalm 51 - 34
    Psalm 66 - 16
    Psalm 67 - 7

    We must understand that God is also a personal God. He is my Saviour, just as He is yours. The psalmists understood this, and used several, and oftentimes many personal pronouns. I truly believe that many of our newer praise and worship songs were constructed from the vein and inspiration of the psalms - many of them have "me" "my" "I" and "our," but they continue to point the worship vertically to Jesus Christ.
     
  2. yod

    yod Member

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    OK...let's take a look at the Psalms you mentioned. Here is Psalm 100.

    1 Shout joyfully to the LORD, all the earth.
    2 Serve the LORD with gladness;Come before Him with joyful singing.
    3 Know that the LORD Himself is God;It is He who has made us, and not we ourselves;
    We are His people and the sheep of His pasture.
    4 Enter His gates with thanksgiving And His courts with praise.Give thanks to Him, bless His name.
    5 For the LORD is good;His lovingkindness is everlasting And His faithfulness to all generations.


    Now compare this focus on songs like ;

    You are all "I" Want


    There is nothing in this Psalm about "me" being the center of God's attention. The only time "we" are mentioned is in relation to blessing "Him". The entire focus is on His greatness, His goodness, His worthyness to be praised. It is a subtle difference, yes, but the serpent was the most subtle beast of the field.

    This is all I'm saying. Not that "me" songs are bad but there are just FAR TOO MANY of them being sung in the church today in relation to the songs whose entire focus is on the Lord.
     
  3. yod

    yod Member

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    Psalms 23 and 55 are some good "me" Psalms....yet note how many "me" Psalms there are in relation to the "Him" (hymn?) Psalms. What is it? About 4 or 5 of the 150 Psalms?


    Here is another one you mentioned as a "me" Psalm. Comments follow below.

    Psalm 66
    1 Shout joyfully to God, all the earth;
    2 Sing the (2) glory of His name;Make His (3) praise glorious.
    3 Say to God, "How (4) awesome are Your works!Because of the greatness of Your power Your enemies will (5) give feigned obedience to You.
    4 "(6) All the earth will worship You,
    And will (7) sing praises to You;
    They will sing praises to Your name."
    5 Come and see the works of God,Who is (9) awesome in His deeds toward the sons of men.
    6 He (10) turned the sea into dry land;They passed through (11) the river on foot;
    There let us (12) rejoice in Him!
    7 He (13) rules by His might forever;His (14) eyes keep watch on the nations; Let not the rebellious (15) exalt themselves. Selah.
    8 Bless our God , O peoples,
    And (16) sound His praise abroad,
    9 Who (17) keeps us in life And (18) does not allow our feet to slip.
    10 For You have (19) tried us, O God;
    You have (20) refined us as silver is refined.
    11 You (21) brought us into the net;You laid an oppressive burden upon our loins.
    12 You made men (22) ride over our heads;We went through (23) fire and through water,Yet You (24) brought us out into a place of abundance.
    13 I shall (25) come into Your house with burnt offerings; I shall (26) pay You my vows,
    14 Which my lips uttered
    And my mouth spoke when I was (27) in distress.
    15
    I shall (28) offer to You burnt offerings of fat beasts,With the smoke of (29) rams;I shall make an offering of bulls with male goats. Selah.
    16 Come and hear, all who [1] fear God,And I will (31) tell of what He has done for my soul.
    17 I cried to Him with my mouth,And He was (32) extolled with my tongue.
    18 If I [2] (33) regard wickedness in my heart,The (34) Lord will not hear;
    19 But certainly (35) God has heard;He has given heed to the voice of my prayer.
    20 Blessed be God,Who (37) has not turned away my prayer Nor His lovingkindness from me.


    Again the Psalmist only mentions "me" in relation to blessing "Him". Can you see the difference in the how songs like "I" Could Sing of Your Love Forever where it talks about God blessing "me"?

    Don't get me wrong...I love that song! But here is another example of the focus being on the personal experience rather than the immutable attributes of God. Please just take the time to look at the lyrics of popular songs and you will find that far too many of them are about God blessing "me" instead of me blessing God.


    We should not be worshipping the Lord only because He blesses us...He is worthy even if He never does anything we agree with.

    So again my point is that there are just too many "me" songs being written and performed these days. It's a question of balance.
     
  4. yod

    yod Member

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    To be intellectually honest I just did a little research of the Psalms. Any Psalm which had even a single sentence that said "incline to me" or anything close to "You bless me" I counted as a ME Psalm.


    As of Psalm 66 it seems to be running pretty consistantly about half & half. Remember, it only had to have ONE phrase or sentence to be counted as a "me" Psalm.

    This doesn't change my mind about the focus of modern worship music being unbalanced in general.
    And I like modern worship!
     
  5. Joshua Rhodes

    Joshua Rhodes <img src=/jrhodes.jpg>

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    Yod,

    I'll agree that the music is pretty unbalanced. But I also believe that it's up to the Worship Leader/Music Minister/Song Leader to choose the songs with good judgment. It is very possible to find songs to do it, sometimes you just have to look further than the Top 25 CCLI list. [​IMG]
     
  6. ScottEmerson

    ScottEmerson Active Member

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    That is where discernment comes in. There are SO many good songs that are out there, but under the radar of most worship leaders, because they're content with the Top-25.
     
  7. Joshua Rhodes

    Joshua Rhodes <img src=/jrhodes.jpg>

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    Agreed, Scott. The word I was searching for was discernment, but I had just gotten up and couldn't think of the word. LOL! Thanks!
     
  8. Dale McNamee

    Dale McNamee New Member

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    Hello Everyone!
    I've been following this thread and wanted to add my comments regarding "blended" services and musical discernment.

    At my church,we have two services on Sunday,one at 8:15,and one at 11am.

    At the 8:15 service,traditional hymns and plainchant are sung and the older liturgy is used. While some of our "senior saints" attend the service,other congregants go because they also like the music and service and it "frees up" the rest of Sunday.

    At the 11am service,the newer liturgy is used and we sing hymns and contemporary P&W music.

    Regarding the selection of music,my music director is a committed Christian,very strong doctrinally,and does "weed out" theologically weak songs,traditional and contemporary.

    He also teaches at the Peabody Conservatory, here in Baltimore,and is an accomplished composer,choir director,organist,and orchestra conductor. He has composed some theologically strong P&W songs along with service music such as the Sanctus and the Kyrie.

    My pastor is also very involved in selecting music that reflects the Scripture readings and the sermon accurately and works with my music director in those selections.

    So,at the 11am service,you will hear traditional hymns and P&W songs sung with SATB harmonies by the congregation,as well as instrumental pieces on piano and organ by Bach, Handel,Purcell,Tallis,Mozart,etc. Also,we use vocal pieces by John Taverner,John Rutter,and other recent composers with the choir. The choir does sing at both services and both services use the same hymns and musical pieces. [​IMG]

    In closing,none of the styles of music(sacred classical,traditional hymns,contemporary,ethnic)need to be excluded in worshipping God. As was stated in a previous post,the music should be BALANCED.

    In Christ,

    Dale
     
  9. Eric B

    Eric B Active Member
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    Actually, this division of history into two categories of generations is overrated. Man was still just as sinful and selfish, only with the pre-boomers, it was a collective "ME", (tradition, human authority), and was just as centered on man, and his authority. So people revolted against it and made it a more personal, "me". since the collective version was less personal, people can "look down their long lofty noses" as Mike Regele, Death of The Church says, and say "look at them: they are so selfish and we are so selfless", but in the very act of doing this, their man-centered self-righteousness is showing in blazing colors.
    The "Cross" was often taken to mean how others' flesh must be "slayed", while the old paradigm was assumed to already be in line with God's standards. This is why it then took on a more personal dimension in the new paradigm.
     
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