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The Power Over Christian Publishing We’ve Given To Amazon

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Squire Robertsson, Oct 8, 2019.

  1. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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  2. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    Tim Challies is one of my favorite blog authors. He makes some good points in his essay. I think there is room for multiple publishing and distribution outlets for Christian books. I purchase books from Banner of Trust, Reformed Baptist Academic Press, and Ligonier. I also purchase books from Amazon but typically not Christian books.
     
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  3. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Unfortunately, the author does not know how things are sold on Amazon. Amazon does not give a hoot if an Amazon seller wants to sell Christian (or pagan) books on Amazon. Amazon will receive their commission for facilitating the buyer-seller exchange.

    There are several ways to sell products on Amazon.

    "Seller fulfilled" means a third party seller lists and sells their products on Amazon. The seller downloads the orders from Amazon and ships the product to the individual buyer. No inventory of the seller is ever handled by Amazon employees.

    "Sold by Squire Robertsson and fulfilled by Amazon" means a third party seller lists and sells their products on Amazon. The seller pays Amazon to pull, pack, and ship the product. The third party seller ships product in bulk to the Amazon distribution centers and Amazon employees ships the product to the end users.

    "Ships and sold by Amazon" means a manufacturer (or a book publisher) sells their product directly to Amazon in bulk. Amazon sets the price, and pulls, packs, and ships the order to the end customer. This is the traditional distributor arrangement.

    The author is objecting to the practice of Amazon declining to purchase books directly from Christian publishers and reselling them on Amazon, or the practice of "Ships and sold by Amazon". If Amazon doesn't want to buy the book and resell it there is nothing stopping the publisher from becoming a third party seller on Amazon and selling their books.
     
    #3 InTheLight, Oct 8, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2019
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  4. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    True. However, Challies is predicting that books about certain topics may be banned from Amazon much like Go Fund Me will not accept crowdfunding campaigns from some Christian and gun rights individuals/organizations. It is a form of political correctness. Also, not every author can afford to self-publish their book(s). Publishing houses front the cost of printing, distribution, and order fulfillment. Many Christian authors lack the capital to do so. In short, if Amazon decides to ban certain books the effected authors will need to find another way to put their books on the market.
     
  5. Rob_BW

    Rob_BW Well-Known Member
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    It's all fun and games til your favorite website's owners decide to host on AWS, and people opposed to your position join up so they can report posts in an effort to deplatform you.
     
  6. MartyF

    MartyF Well-Known Member

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    FUTURE CRIME!!!

    Yep, we need to condemn people for crimes they might commit (sarcasm). Tim Challies is learning at the feet of Democrats.

    The publisher can still publish directly from Amazon using the online publication feature. Tim Challies actually wants to force Amazon to buy his physical books whether they will sell or not and whether or not they will make a profit. Tim Challies must have been a big proponent of the Affordable Care Act.

    No one is preventing the publication of lousy semi-Christian literature. I think that pressuring people to buy your stuff in this manner is improper.
     
  7. MartyF

    MartyF Well-Known Member

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    As long as alternative means of communication are not illegalized, this should be fine.

    Now, there are cases where alternatives are illegalized. For example, I can't start a TV station even if the broadcasting frequencies are available unless I get FCC approval. Same for radio stations. Non-approved billboards are illegal and getting approval requires government support. Other government restrictions are problematic. I don't think twitter/facebook are quite the same. There are alternatives and you don't have to use them - I don't.
     
  8. Rob_BW

    Rob_BW Well-Known Member
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    So you would be fine if, hypothetically, the Baptistboard switched hosts to some company with a "progressive" AUP, non-Christians began signing up as Christians, and then they pick an issue (homosexuality as sin will serve as an example) to report posts as hate speech, getting most of the original membership banned and radically transforming the site into a bastion of godless theological liberalism?

    That might sound like an extreme hypothetical situation, but it's on the horizon.

    Some people realize they're in a culture war, some people don't. Now is the time to be sly as foxes, not the time to roll over and say "oh well" when the enemy is on the attack.
     
  9. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    I would not "be fine" with it, but the new owners of the board can do what they want with it--it's their prerogative.

    I suppose I would try to find another forum to discuss theological and political issues that was aligned more closely with my beliefs.

    As an aside, I'm kind of curious as to why the owners of Baptist Board do not have a mechanism for accepting contributions from members. If members could donate to the board it would ease any cash flow problems, give the owners pause if they were contemplating selling the board, and give members a sense of "stock ownership".
     
  10. MartyF

    MartyF Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't like it. But as long as I am not banned by the entire internet, I can post as I please somewhere else ,or start my own blog, or start mailing/e-mail letters, etc. And yes, there are "Christian" forums I have had to leave due to disagreements with the administrators. I don't think Mr. Robinson should be forced to host my posts if he doesn't want to.
     
  11. MartyF

    MartyF Well-Known Member

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    What is really problematic is what is happening in China which is fully controlling all media and religion. If Mr. Robinson removed me from the forum because he didn't like what I said, that is one thing. If Mr. Robinson threw me in jail for what I said, that is another.

    Controlling the most popular website is not the same thing as controlling all the websites. If Amazon had a true monopoly, I would have a problem with it. But, I can buy or sell my books elsewhere if I want to. And that choice is freedom.
     
  12. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

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    I see Challies' scenario very plausible and not in the realm of fantasy.
     
  13. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Sure, Amazon can refuse to buy and resell a publisher's books. Just like a Christian bookstore could refuse to buy and resell an LGBT publisher's books.

    But virtually anybody can be a seller on Amazon, so if they wanted their books listed on Amazon and sold on Amazon it could be done.
     
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